God Damned Fundies!
|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: CONSTANTS
|Date: 26 Dec 96 10:47:38
EID:da9d 219a55e0
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d2b
AS> nothing to constrain them. You can look at that idea...that they
AS> could not
AS> be different...in two different ways. That this is the only logically
AS> self-consistent universe possible...which seems contradicted by what
AS> we can devise in model universes....or that we happen to have these
AS> constants
AS> by total chance. Interesting chances.
RH> Or, more correctly, that the constants describe the fundamental nature
RH> of matter/energy and thus can have NO other values.
Again, that would imply that this is the only self-consistent universe
possible. But we have no evidence for that.
AS> How is that different from someone in the Dark Ages saying, "I don't
AS> see how the sun could NOT rise in the morning, and even if it could
do
AS> differently, it doesn't, so it is a moot point"? I think the
AS> question is still worth asking.
RH> But you keep coming up with the wrong ANSWER! God is not an answer.
RH> He is a cop-out. For example the everything has a cause argument.
RH> You then say Well, God is the First Cause and He is an exception
RH> to the rule. He has no cause. Cop-out.
Yes, which is one reason I don't use that argument. There is nothing
intrinsically WRONG with the idea of an infinite regress. We find it hard
to imagine, but there could be an infinite number of causes out there.
AS> Would you rather I believe the religious stuff without a logical
AS> starting point?
RH> Yes. Then you wouldn't keep pestering us with nonsense.
I dunno...it's the ones who believe without reason that, I think, become
fanatics more easily.
AS> I know that, Roger. You're one of the better people here. Take care.
RH> And you, as well, no matter what everyone else says here!
Thanks.
... "Are you suggesting that coconuts are migratory?" - Monty Python
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Ronald Vass
|Sub: CONSTANTS
|Date: 26 Dec 96 10:48:43
EID:85c1 219a5600
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d2c
AS> Although we have yet to make Hari Seldon's psychohistory.
RV> So your Christ was the mule . . . very interesting.
So who's the Second Foundation?
... Operator, trace this call and tell me where I am.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: Dark Bible #4
|Date: 26 Dec 96 10:56:04
EID:85d1 219a5700
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d2d
JB> Speakable and Unspeakable in Quantum Mechanics (Bell)
AS> Of Bell's theorem fame? Nope.
JB> Yes. Good stuff.
Ok, that makes him even more interesting.
JB> Gad, man, you're a _reader_! You've got most of all you need, to see
JB> the same general pattern I think I see....
I've read four books a week since I was eighteen or so. Not necessarily
anything along those lines...anything this side of Harlequin romances,
really. Cheap mystery, bad science fiction, etc.
AS> Excellent! Most of those I haven't read, although I read the Bell's
AS> Theorem one which was reproduced in an book about questions about
AS> quantum mechanics. (Been a couple of years, though, can't remember
AS> the author.) I've read excerpts of Einstein's EPR paper.
AS> Thanks a lot, John.
JB> Welcome. I need to add a few, since the list is already three years
JB> old.
JB> You've probably got what you need, to understand why I think what I
JB> think....
JB> I'd recommend, however, the Scully paper, and anything on the subject
JB> by his cohorts Kwiat and Steinberg. One needs that "delayed choice"
JB> stuff to _really_ twist the mind around backwards....
Sounds like fun! I wasn't able to get out to the library this weekend,
hopefully I'll be able to do so this upcoming weekend.
I LOVE stuff that makes me go, "What?"
... MEGAHERTZ: When something is really painful.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Ronald Vass
|Sub: enochban.rit
|Date: 26 Dec 96 20:45:59
EID:2b47 219aa5a0
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d2e
CJ> My apologies to Michael Hardy.
RV> D O N ' T !! do that, Al will believe your sucking up to him.
Nope. That's Lynda's job, to insinuate that others believe in Hardy's
"sucking up".
... The crisis of today is the joke of tomorrow.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: errors in the christa
|Date: 26 Dec 96 11:09:50
EID:09d4 219a5920
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d2f
AS> Right. BTW, ever read his JOB? To really enjoy it, it helps if you
AS> have read Cabell first...because Koschei, the power behind all gods,
AS> is lefted from Cabell directly into Heinlein's scenario.
JB> (*Hmmm.... hole in my reading list....Cabell....)
JURGEN was his most famous novel. THE SILVER STALLION is good too, and so
is CREAM OF THE JEST, but I don't think you should start out with CREAM.
JB> I've read every novel Heinlein wrote, including "Job." My first S-F
JB> novel was "Star Beast" --at the age of 12 or so-- followed by Andre
JB> Norton's "Ad Astra." Then "Red Planet" and onward from there for
JB> eight or nine hundred other novels (excluding short stories) over the
JB> years.
JB> _more_ pertinent today than it was in the early sixties....
Yes. He ages well.
AS> Yes. I've heard, off and on, that there is going to be a movie about
AS> it...last person I've heard mentioned for Mike was Tom Hanks. Not my
AS> image of Mike, though.
JB> No, nor mine. I've heard the rumor. That task has got to be
JB> equivalently difficult to the movie-ization of "Dune," which in my
JB> opinion failed --if not quite miserably. As you note, though,
JB> "Starship Troopers" IS being produced. That one's not _nearly_ as
JB> hard to put on screen as "Stranger..." would be. IMHO, Valentine
JB> Michael Smith had better be a completely unknown actor with an
JB> _incredible_ range....
I would suggest it would be best as a mini-series, to develop the ideas.
Just putting it in two hours things would be rushed and many of the finer
things would be lost.
AS> Heinlein got a lot of us by writing GOOD juvenile sf. In most school
JB> ....And Andre Norton...
Yep.
AS> libraries, he was there, with things like RED PLANET and such. So
JB> My daughters are 11 and 12, the 12-year-old about three years' worth
JB> of subjective maturation ahead of the 11-year-old. This Christmas,
JB> the elder gets "Stranger..." and the younger gets "Red Planet." (I'm
JB> going to hint to the elder that Stranger... is a "very dangerous
JB> book"....*g*)
That'll work!!
... Cthulu loves me, this I know, for the Necronomicon tells me so!
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Gwenny the Pooh
|Sub: execute her ?
|Date: 26 Dec 96 11:11:25
EID:8251 219a5960
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d30
GtP>> young men in here are like that. Maybe I should write up some
GtP>> guidelines to getting girls.
AS> Yes...and send them to Quentin. And is Dave Rice still a virgin?
AS> Me, I lucked into finding my wife.
GtP> Okay, I'm working it. As for David, I don't know. There have been
GtP> several of us willing to remedy that, but he hides in his tent.
Maybe he found a tentmate of his own.
... I think sex is better than logic, but I can't prove it.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: FREE WILL
|Date: 26 Dec 96 21:56:42
EID:5ae1 219aaf00
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d31
AS> But of course, it depends on whether Hell is just a matter of the
AS> extinction of the soul, a metaphor for nonexstence, or not.
LB>
LB>
LB> No, Al. It doesn't matter at all. Unless the victim is STILL going to
LB> be injured emotionally by the experience in the hereafter, there is
no
LB> reason for the perpetrator to be tortured, quarantened, or
LB> extinguished. Not as far as the victim would be concerned.
That's a remarkably silly assumption. Do I REALLY want, say, my wife
making it to Heaven, only to have Richard Speck, Jack the Ripper, and Ted
Bundy in the next palace on the streets of gold? Quarentine at the very
least is mandated to keep Heaven Heavenly.
LB> Now, you've got God thinking up infinite delights for those in
LB> heaven...we are told AS VICTIMS that there will be no more tears in
LB> heaven, that the victims will find solace and true healing from the
LB> traumas worked on them. Can't a God who can, through joy, do that not
LB> spare any of that infinity to work in some healing for those
LB> victimIZERS as well? He's got eternity to do it in, what's the problem?
LB> Why a final solution to a temporal problem when one is in a plane of
LB> infinite nonfinality?
Because those who reach Heaven in some manner agree to the need for
correction. That is what forgiveness entails...admitting to God you did
wrong, and an implicit agreement not to do it again (which doesn't always
succeed, but the intent needs to be there.) Those who do not agree to such
conditions reject even that proferred hand.
It all comes down to us saying to God, Thy Will be done...or God saying
to us, THY will be done.
LB> Why would I or anyone else be interested in revenge or be still so
LB> emotionally affected by the experience of rape and victimization that
i
LB> will....an eternity from now....still be unable to face my victimizer
LB> without fear or hatred, unless I am still going to be traumatized by
LB> it? And if I am...how is that "heaven"?
No; turn it around. If the victimizer is there, and has learned
nothing...how is that "heaven"? Should people be able to stalk in
Heaven?
LB> Anything done to the victimer AFTER my death is not done for my sake
-
LB> if God chooses revenge, it is his, for his reasons and has nothing to
LB> do with me. It does ME no good. Therefore, telling me that, while he
LB> never got around to stopping anything or even making himself known
LB> enough to let me know that He was there was tough, I should remember
LB> that He'll get around to it LATER is of absolutely no comfort.
But it may be for the good that it is done, not the evil. If Joe is in
Heaven...even if say, magic walls came up between you and him...he could
still say hateful things and wound you thereby. Hopefully you will be
beyond that...but only if you can get past that. Will it be possible if
he
is there?
LB> If I should find myself before God, healed from that trauma, I will
LB> plead Joe's case. And ask why nothing was done when it would have done
LB> BOTH of us some good.
And He might answer back, "Because Joe never asked." Because He might
point out that the greatest love, the greatest gifts, are the ones that
are given freely, and not forced. That your very outrage at what Joe
forced YOU to do...is the exact reason why HE did not force JOE to do
anything. Or not do anything.
LB> Of course...it works if you're telling it to someone else...that it
LB> does NOT work for those living within the context of Cepp'as question
LB> ought to tell you something.
It works sometimes if you're living it, Lynda. Otherwise everyone who
suffers a horrible fate would have stopped being religious. That is not
the case. I know women who have come to our church to ESCAPE an abusive
husband. I have myself stayed (with my wife) with a woman who was afraid
of her husband coming back and killing her if no one is with her.
LB> Oh, I absolutely suspect you have, beyond things you have mentioned.
LB> Intellectualizing what BELONGS in the arena of emotion is a survival
LB> tactic that is not uncommon in post-trauma coping. It's apparent
LB> enough that you do it that you have at times been suspected by multiple
LB> people of creating anecdotes, simply because you so completely remove
LB> your own emotions from the retelling.
They may think what they wish, of course.
LB> Therefore you are not living within the context of Dan's question,
LB> because you haven't allowed yourself to get close enough to the
LB> feelings behind it to even understand it.
There's no real good way to answer that. If I say, "parlor psychology!"
or
even cite the psychiatrist whom I saw when younger, I'm being defensive.
If I say you're right, then anything I say will be discounted because of
the possible bias I bring to that. Nevertheless, I do not discount the
well-reasoned points you have made because of your earlier abuse, and I
think you would take serious offense at me if I did. Or if I ignored what
Ron said because of that. Yet if my "intellectualization" is to be
discounted because of what I may have endured--or not--in the past, then
how is that different? I will do you the courtesy of assuming you mean
what you say, without thinking that it is an emotion-driven defense of
your earlier abuse. You may do what you like, of course. (One might add
parenthetically that a side effect of such a view is that one will rarely
be granted views of anything of a personal nature, lest it be brought up
as a possible objection to what one SAYS. That few confidences will be
exchanged, for fear that one will see the past event
and--mistakenly--apply it to everything. We see that often in biographies,
where they try to see everything about an individual in light of one or
two incidents in the person's past. In my experience, people are much more
complex than that.)
... Real men don't beat women.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: FREE WILL
|Date: 26 Dec 96 20:52:13
EID:abcc 219aa680
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d32
AS> But of course, it depends on whether Hell is just a matter of
AS> the extinction of the soul, a metaphor for nonexstence, or
AS> not.
MG> No it doesn't. Aside from the fact that no one has ever shown me that
MG> any kind of hell exists in any form, we now arrive at this point where
MG> you are still claiming that hell exists in the form of some kind of
MG> punishment.
No; in the form of some sort of quarentine, perhaps.
MG> Lynda's point is valid....where is god to punish severly enough the
MG> mortal that commits these acts. surely, if a place of fire and
MG> brimstone is not enough to scare them straight, a souless eternity
MG> will not do it either.
Which is one reason why hell very well might be eternal. The choice to
avoid the right path is, perhaps, self-perpetuating.
MG> It's another aspect of your gods limited ability in your free will
MG> theory where we are free to do evil even if it hurts someone else.
MG> Many persons do fear punishment for one reason or the other. Where
is
MG> your god when men rape and kill 9 year olds? Threatening them with
MG> something that doesn't scare them?
Now; is the doing good because fear of punishment the highest reason to
do
so? Or is it better to do so because it is good? And yet a god who does
not reward good action is unjust. But if the reward was, at best, not
immediately perceivable...we can still have people acting for good because
it IS good, and nevertheless reward them for it.
... Frisbyterian: When you die, your soul goes up on the roof.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: FREE WILL
|Date: 26 Dec 96 21:41:18
EID:6476 219aad20
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d33
ML> Eternity with a deity of his choice.
AS> Yes. IF.
ML> Bolshoi "if", AL.
Possibly.
AS> But most rapists become repeat offenders, if offered the opportunity.
ML> Do you have statistics to support this claim?
Let's see.
According to George Allen, a governor of Virginia, three out of four
violent crimes...including rape...are done by repeat offenders...according
to something I pulled off the internet. Of course, he's a politician, so
take it with a grain of salt...
AS> "Neither do I judge you. Go, and sin no more." You have to turn from
AS> the sin to show you are in earnest. Oh, you can fall occasionally, but
AS> rape's not one of those things that I would consider an occasional
AS> fall. It's a deliberate act of violence. It's like saying you're
AS> sorry you're a killer...and then going out and shooting someone.
AS> It puts the lie to your very words.
ML> No matter. Just repent and be very, very sorry on your death
ML> bed (gurney, chair, scaffold, whatever) and *POOF*, instant
ML> eternal enhancement with your favorite deity.
If you mean it, and are saying it not to save oneself, and wouldn't do it
again even if miraculously restored to health...why not?
... Everyone hates me because I'm paranoid.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: humor the fundy fools
|Date: 26 Dec 96 20:56:24
EID:af3c 219aa700
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d34
AS> It follows that no overall account of the universe can be
AS> true unless that account leaves it possible for our thinking
AS> to be a real insight. A theory which explained everyting
MG> Here is where your arguement falls flat on its face. Any account of
MG> the universe which is true is just that....true. Truth is not
MG> something that we need to worry about, as long as it's a materialistic
MG> truth. Once we determine th3 true nature of the universe we will not
MG> need to worry about it any longer. Your constant insistance that
MG> there is purpose gets int hte way of true insightful thinking.
No disputing that what is true is true. But asking if we are sure if what
we are measuring true is true. You can't see whether, say, a certain class
of measuring device is accurate or not by using that same measuring device
to measure the accuracy of the others....
... And now, for something completely different.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
* Origin: Skeeter Haven "Nashville, TN" (615) 872-8609 (1:116/17)
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Rick Mcfarlane
|Sub: IN PASSING
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:11:54
EID:4a13 219a6960
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d35
RM> That's always been my take on Al's favourite co-incidences. Maybe
RM> some day we'll know the reason for them, and maybe that reason is God.
RM> And maybe it's something physical that is just beyond our
RM> comprehension right now. (I tend to think it's the latter).
It's certainly possible. Of course, you could say that about ANYTHING.
That any argument we give can be explained by our lack of knowledge. But
we have to work with what we have.
... Nostalgia...all the good times you never had.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Gwenny the Pooh
|Sub: Jesus needed...
|Date: 26 Dec 96 20:57:50
EID:8382 219aa720
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d36
AS> just talking about eunuchs. (Are castrated men who program internet
AS> providers eunuchs with Unix?)
GtP> That's the second time I've seen that pun in as many days. ARGH!
Sorry about that. I feel ill...I need to take some Castrate oil...
... Always remember to pillage BEFORE you burn.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: more babbling email
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:23:34
EID:5b1e 219a6ae0
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d37
LB> BTW, Harpy reference made by Al one hour before i downloaded this
LB> packet. Not that that MEANS anything, of course.... ;)
Well, considering we were talking about comic pictures of many of the
participants here, and Mike's is TRULY funny...his face plastered on a
long horned goat with a pentagram behind him, looking like something out
of a bad Exorcist rip-off,,,and you all made suggestions about what to use
for me...and then Judith and several others wondered what they could use
for themselves and I made a passing reference that I had pictures of the
Harpies...I can only conclude that everybody else can make jokes EXCEPT
me.
Ahhhh, well. Many people are good at being the givers of humor, but
bristle when they are the recipients of it...
... Flog 'em if they can't take a joke!
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: more babbling email
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:26:10
EID:5b1e 219a6b40
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d38
LB> hehe...what was Alice's lament? "I give myself very good advice, but
LB> very seldom follow it..." ;)
Thank you, Alice.
AS> Anyway, Lynda, have a nice holiday season, and Merry Christmas. Both
AS> you, George, and the kids.
LB> :) will do. you too.
I did, thanks.
... Operator, trace this call and tell me where I am.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: more physics comedy
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:34:01
EID:b167 219a6c40
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d39
ML> Only if you have covalent bands.
AS> I try to keep current...
ML> I hear you play the guitar, put the ampere.
Excuse me while I read a DC comic book...
AS> That's a shocking answer...
ML> Need new power, must revolt.
You could solve it peacefully...have the people choose their
leaders...have them run and debate, and let the people choose...you know,
an electron.
... A good pun is its own reword.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: NEVER BE GODLY
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:36:18
EID:d270 219a6c80
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3a
RS> Nor does Al remember being weaned . . . yet I bet he doesn't
RS> start grabbing breasts when looking for a snack . . .
LB> This is Al we're talking about...I'm not taking any bets. ;)
Define "snack".
... I yam Popeye of the Borg. Prepares ta beez askimiligrated
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: NEVER BE GODLY
|Date: 26 Dec 96 20:59:21
EID:d270 219aa760
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3b
LB> Why? I don't recall learning how to walk or talk, or how to control
my
LB> bladder ...yet the lesson stays with me.
AS> Good point.
LB> :) thank you.
LB> As far as I have heard, that's how the idea of reincarnation
LB> works...between lives, you know what you've learned, what you still
LB> need to learn, minus the emotionality and vagaries of physical
LB> existance that lead us to be blind to ourselves.
LB> You choose your lessons, set your path. Failure to learn a lesson
LB> means you will continue, through life after life after life until you
LB> get it right. Then onto the next lesson.
LB> I would think, in such a context, remaining aware of the circumstances
LB> of all the other lessons would be distracting rather than helpful,
LB> rather like daydreaming about the novel being read in Lit. class during
LB> a math exam... thinking about it is not, in itself a BAD thing, simply
LB> inappropriate at that moment, since it keeps you from devoting yourself
LB> to the task at hand.
But OTOH, suppose you are being PUNISHED for what you have done in a past
life. In other words, the lesson never "took" at all. Suppose one is an
adult and still does not have his bladder under control. He or she will
have to be aware and learn it to master it, would they not?
See, your objection works as long as you LEARN the lesson. But if one
never learns to walk when young, due to disability, they still have to
learn when healed later. And they must be able to remember the lesson.
Those who do not learn in a life the consequnces of their acts are "stuck".
They will repeat the same mistakes over and over.
... Even the smallest candle burns bright in the darkness.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Curtis Johnson
|Sub: oh wells
|Date: 26 Dec 96 13:48:44
EID:6291 219a6e00
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3c
CJ> My apologies for some of the tone in my most recent posts
CJ> to you. But I've at last OD'd on your sheer volume, and need
CJ> a break. I would weary of even the most _sympatico_ correspondent
CJ> if they persistently sent me 18-20 lengthy missives at a time.
Understandable. Enjoy the break.
... "And my ending is despair unless I be reliev'd by prayer"--Shakespeare
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Laurie Appleton
|Sub: Opinions and Excsuse.
|Date: 26 Dec 96 14:12:14
EID:6d9a 219a7180
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3d
-=> Quoting Laurie Appleton to Al Schroeder <=-
LA> Hi Al,
LA> (Re: yours of 18-Dec-1996, "Opinions and Excuses.")
LA> Mind you he claims to be a Christian and is much less
AS> Rick McFarlane is a Baha'i. A minor quibble, since they
AS> do believe Jesus was an Incarnation of the Divine, as they
AS> believe Mohammed, Buddha, Krishna, and others are. But one I
AS> think you are unaware of.
LA> Then Rick seems to want to be "on side" with them ALL, I
LA> suppose, in the hope that at least ONE of them will be right
LA> and will not mind if he was "flirting" with the others! The
LA> Jews were guilty of the same silly behavior on many
LA> occasions, weren't they, and that did NOT seem to be such a
LA> good idea, did it?
That's a remarkably glib accusation of an entire religious faith, which
seems to be one of the more peaceful and well-reasoned ones around.
LA> I can understand the "Krishna" bit of course, since he
LA> does seem to ramble on rather incoherently most of the time!
LA> One is reminded of Adolf Hitler's advice about; "Tell a Lie,
LA> make it a big one, repeat it often . . . . ." That seems to
LA> sum up his "science" rather well - or should I say that sums
LA> up what MOST evolutionist do most of the time as they and
LA> imagine that they are being scientific! :-)
(Gentle smile.) You're comparing Rick McFarlane...or anyone who believes
in Krishna...with Hitler?
(To all) How often do I REALLY get mad with someone? (Cracking
knuckles.)
You IGNORANT, LYING, STUPID EXCUSE for an apologist, you BRAINDEAD
disgrace to Christianity, AND to Humanity, Rick has treated you with FAR
more patience than you deserve or merit, has exposed your pitiful LIES and
MISQUOTINGS repeatedly, and has generally outargued you ten ways till
Sunday. You are making Christianity a laughing stock, and although I am
not ashamed to be a Christian, I AM ashamed that you are part of it. You
distort the truth to deny it; you lie for God, which is neither a service
to God or to yourself. No one has granted you even the slightest credit
for making a point. We ALL are laughing at you and your
misrepresentations, and it is EMBARASSING to see you claim the same
religion as I.
I would rather be a nonbeliever than someone who claims to have found
the light...and then lies to try to get other people to join it.
You are hurting the Faith, and maligning one who has never done you
harm, save to tell the truth. "Ye shall know them by their fruits". Your
fruit is lies, and we know who is the father of lies. Your reliance on
misrepresnting people shows where your true allegiance lies.
... Your family's Coat-of-Arms ties in the back - is that normal?
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Chris Green
|Sub: query
|Date: 26 Dec 96 14:14:23
EID:531d 219a71c0
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3e
-=> Quoting Chris Green to Martin Goldberg <=-
CG> You wouldn't happen to be the Goldberg who was teamed with Sticker?
CG> Dealing with immunology?
CG> The same person who Michael Martinez quotes frequently and
CG> extensively? (To be found in the echo Gender and Feminism)
MISquotes. Trust me.
... A child educated only at school is an uneducated child. - Santayana
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Gwenny the Pooh
|Sub: Rant Wars with "Commie Sue".
|Date: 26 Dec 96 14:17:32
EID:d2a9 219a7220
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d3f
GtP> Sean, luv, I really don't think is the place for this.
And never was, I think.
... I used to have a handle on life, then it broke.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: SUPERSTION
|Date: 26 Dec 96 14:27:08
EID:92f9 219a7360
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d40
AS> Probably. He would have thought it more likely to have his legs
AS> broken, as happened to the two thieves.
RH>
RH> Oh, no. The prophecy said his bones would not be broken. He HAD to
RH> "die" before that could happen.
Maybe He had poison in a hollow tooth, and crunched it to make sure he
would die before they could break it.
AS> Ok. Let's say He was expecting God to come rescue Him. He goes into
a
AS> deathlike coma. The others put on graveclothes on Him, and put Him in
AS> a sealed tomb.
RH> Not sealed. They expected to come prepare his body after the Sabbath.
Well, one account at least says sealed. But for argument's sake, we'll say
that's an exaggeration.
AS> He wakes up. Comes out of His coma. He is in a sealed tomb, so
AS> probably the air is getting rank, filled without all the fragrances
AS> with which they
AS> put on his body (from the hundred pounds of stuff, it probably
AS> smelled like a perfume factory.) He gropes around, IN THE DARK, and
AS> although a few
AS> minutes ago so near death that people thought he WAS dead...and moves
AS> a stone that is SEALED, and which two grown women of an era where a
AS> lot of women did heavy manual labor were wondering how they could
AS> move. Andrenelin? We're talking more SUPERMAN here.
RH> We're talking outside help, here.
Could be. Agreed on beforehand? Then He is knowingly helping with a fraud.
AS> And after that, with wounds in His feet, He walks the ten miles to
AS> Emmaneus.
RH> May not have been him at all. He was not recognised at the time.
Probably grimacing too much because His feet were killing him...
AS> That ALMOST works...unless you start to wonder why in the world
AS> Joseph had a tomb with a hidden passage. It's like all those bad
AS> movies where every castle or old house had a secret passage. It would
AS> have to be dug ahead of time....
AS> See what I mean how alternative explanations violate what we DO
AS> know about human nature and situations, whereas we have no way to
AS> evaluate the probability of a Resurrection?
RH> I wouldn't buy that version either.
Good. What sort of version WOULD you buy?
... A journey of a thousand miles gets 1500 frequent flier miles.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: Warring Christanic Factions
|Date: 26 Dec 96 22:09:09
EID:58df 219ab120
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d41
LB> Oh! That's so special, Al! A subtle accusation of him
LB> "sucking up" to the heathens....
RS> You thought that subtle?
LB> well, he didn't spell out S-u-c-k-i-n-g u-p or give us 12 quotes from
LB> Hawking and C.S. Lewis to bolster it...for Al, that is subtle.
And for you it is...? For you are the only one spelling it out...
LB> Subtle enough that he'll feel he can be injured that I'd even THINK
LB> such a think. Wanna bet? ;)
You lose. It did not surprise me.
Unfortunately.
... "I think thou doth protest too much."
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
* Origin: Skeeter Haven "Nashville, TN" (615) 872-8609 (1:116/17)
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: Warring Christanic Factions
|Date: 26 Dec 96 22:05:51
EID:58df 219ab0a0
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d42
LB> Oh! That's so special, Al! A subtle accusation of him "sucking up" to
LB> the heathens....
AS> Odd. You're the only one who seems to have drawn that conclusion,
AS> including Mike himself.
LB> Odd. As of the moment you wrote the above, you hadn't spoken with
LB> Michael at all on the matter, one way or another. God tell you what
LB> his take on it was?
If He had, it would have been confirmed by Mike's admission of, he didn't
see it until you pointed it out.. But I had had a response from Mike by
then. And Mike means what he says.
LB> Oh, and I've already gotten one comment suggesting it was a bit of
LB> underkill to call it subtle. Your barometer for knowing what everyone
LB> thinks doesn't seem to work so well, Al.
From Richard? ROFL!!! You DO know he has me twitted don't you? So the
first time he saw that line was from YOUR comment...coupled with the
"sucking up". Hardly seeing it without a bias already expressed, is it?
LB> Now, explain to me this....would it be accurate to conclude from this
LB> that, when you point to someone being in some sort of agreement with
LB> you - whether it be a person here, or a literary reference - that to
LB> you, SILENCE on the matter indicates agreement with whatever you are
LB> seeking support for?
Mike, if he were ticked off at me, would SAY so. He didn't. And admits he
didn't even see that until YOU mentioned it...and has later said some more
things in private /msg on #irc.
So, no, it would not be accurate. It would vary from person to person. I
was dealing with Mike, however, and have some small idea of how he
responds.
AS> Not at all. I'm overjoyed that Marilyn, for instance, is speaking to
AS> him again.
LB> Cool. Doubt she had your joy in mind at all. What does that comment
LB> have to do with the statement of mine directly preceeding it?
The "why are you so bitter" type thing? Since I never said or implied
anything of the sort, I didn't feel it deserved comment.
... Half the truth is often a great lie. - Franklin
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Warring Christanic Factions
|Date: 26 Dec 96 15:19:54
EID:5133 219a7a60
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d43
AS> Granted, for you, anyway. I just find it somewhat ironic,
AS> considering some of the words that have been bandied back
AS> and forth here in the past.
MG> I disagreed with Mike before and was not what I would consdier to be
MG> overly unnice to him. I have taken exception to things that atheists
MG> have said here and said so. I notice where some of the other atheists
MG> have done the same thing. Whether you are nice to him or not is not
MG> based on his belief or lack of belief, but how big a twit he is.
MG> I will argue the topic with you or Mike or Lee or anyone else here.
I
MG> will tell them when I think that they are dancing around the point or
MG> whatever. The only time I become unpleasent is when we get morons
MG> like Appleton or Wolff. The conference is not real life, although it
MG> partially mirrors it. Thos of us tht realize this, will be a lot
MG> happier.
Very true, and when you have disagreed with Mike (or myself. or others)
it
has always been on substantive issues.
... I'm not evil, I'm "morally challenged".
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Al Schroeder
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: Welcome to the state of TAXES.
|Date: 26 Dec 96 15:25:28
EID:ff96 219a7b20
MSGID: 1:116/17.0 32c34d44
ML> A major pain-in-the-ass episode.
AS> It sounds it.
ML> Major League Charles Fox material.
It's amazing how some goverment officials think they are "stimulating" the
economy while stamping out free enterprise.
AS> Mike Hardy works at a paper.
ML> You really need to stop leaving straight lines lying about like
ML> that, Al.
I thougtht I'd give you an opening...
AS> He might have some ideas...and he's back
AS> on the echo, in the agnostic camp.
ML> Which I find somewhat curious and altogether very unusual.
ML> Might it be that we're being set up for a grand Hardyesque
ML> jape?
No. Or I can't say for sure, of course, but I trust Mike to tell me the
truth. Perhaps "open-minded agnostic" is too strong a term, even though
it was the title he gave Katherine for his alignment...questioner might
be
closer. But you might ask him yourself.
... You shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you freak.
--- Blue Wave/Max v2.12 [NR]
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Becke Jones
|Sub: Upchuck Filet.
|Date: 19 Dec 96 07:55:00
EID:2de2 21933ee0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32b88454
On 10-08-96 at 15:00, BECKE JONES wrote to MARTY LEIPZIG:
BJ> ML> I'm sure it wasn't, I was just making light of the name. I've
BJ> ML> seen a 60 minutes or other such crapola show about the
BJ> ML> fundymaniacs at Chick Filet (at least I spell the damn thing
BJ> ML> correctly). Start every meeting with a prayer and have a
BJ> ML> general laying on of hands throughout the board meeting. In
BJ> Just brought to mind something very ironic. A friend of mine in NJ works
at
BJ> Chick-Fil-A. Ironic thing is, he's both a heathen and a flaming queen.
;)
BJ> (And very open about both, at that). Hmm...
I remember to boycott Cracker Barrel at *every* possibility due
to their chain-wide policy of terminating the employment of
people whose sexual orientation *is* or *perceived* to be
non-straight.
Rod "...fundymorons there, everyone!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Death is 99 per cent fatal to laboratory rats.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: wisdom
|Date: 20 Dec 96 09:26:02
EID:f523 21944b40
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32b9eb2a
On 07-08-96 at 22:53, DAN CEPPA wrote to JIM STAAL:
DC> KS> Brown Wave: 75,000 piles of shit at a PK meeting.
DC> JS> Such bigoted hatred. You really must do something about that.
DC> We are. That's why we are trying to stop groups like the PK.
I'm the mortal enemy of alt.org.promisekeepers. The PromiseFilth
in that newsgroup don't like dissenting opinion -- to the point
of cancelling my posts...
... which of course end in the TERMINATION of their accounts by
sysadmins, or if the sysadmin of their system *is* them, the
cutting of their link.
Rod "...besides, they're not only anti-women, but
anti-everything-not-male-and-straight-and-Christian" Swift...
* SLMR 2.1 * ASCII and ye shall receive.
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Satan a daddy?
|Date: 21 Dec 96 09:31:04
EID:5cb4 21954be0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb3dd8
On 11-08-96 at 11:31, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to DON MARTIN:
CD> Are you really a Liberal? Jack Kemp will be just the tonic the
CD> inner cities need.
Probably in the same way gay people would worship the opportunity
for Patrick Bu-kkk-anan to initiate legislative denigration and
genocide should he *ever* win power in elected government?
Rod "...ah, I thought so." Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Never sent a cretin to do a moron's job!
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Satan a daddy?
|Date: 21 Dec 96 09:35:06
EID:5cb4 21954c60
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb3eca
On 11-08-96 at 11:31, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
CD> Poor spelling indicates dropping out of school, or not studying
CD> thoroughly. What is your academic level?
That's an ironic claim, Clayton. Have you been equal and fair in
your treatment and criticised other echo users over a simple
spelling flame? Say, Jimson Staalin? :)
He doesn't even know what erudite means, and claims to be an
"English Major" (generally refers to completion of a college
degree with such course of intense studies completed to the
course requirements, no?)
Of course, as we all know, a cheap spelling flame in use normally
means the accuser is just trying to dodge the question. Cheap
spelling flames are invariably diversionary tactics for those who
find questions too hard to answer.
Rod "...by the way, there were three questions requiring your
answers in this post. Please answer them. :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Today's topic: Name alternatives to eternal nothingness.
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Treating Aids???
|Date: 21 Dec 96 09:47:08
EID:9194 21954de0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb419c
On 11-08-96 at 11:31, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to MARTIN GOLDBERG:
CD> Not only can you not type nor spell accurately, your logic is badly
CD> in need of amendment.
You claim the below is logic? Normally logical examination of
evidence and conclusions that show direct causality.
Example:
1) I hit my finger with a hammer
2) It hurt, so I saw a doctor
3) The doctor could not ascertain if I had injured it
badly
4) The doctor recommended an x-ray
5) I went to a radiologist
6) They took the x-ray
7) They examined and reported that my thumb was broken
8) My thumb was cast at the doctor's office
9) Jesus died for my sins
These statements form a logical set of steps or processes
by simply following them, until step 8. From there, step 9 has
no logical causal relationship.
CD> You're alive. That's all the evidence you get.
Some would conject you are brain-dead, Clayton.
CD> 1. Sex caused it.
CD> 2. Your biological father stuck something someplace.
CD> 3. Sperm swam upstream.
CD> 4. Yo momma's egg embraced it.
CD> 5. You were born with a brain and the will to choose.
CD> 6. God did his part 1996 years ago.
CD> 7. God doesn't care what choice you make and will allow you to go
CD> to Hell with his blessing.
CD> 8. I'm no greater than God. So, go to Hell, with my blessing.
In the process of the creation of Richard's existence, steps 1
through 5 are correct. The claim that the free will in step five
was caused by God (points 6-7) have no causal link to existence,
nor verifiable proof that they happened. Steps 1-5 are clearly
tenable. It is undeniable that Richard is here because of some
form of reproduction.
Step 8 is based on the theoretical belief by *you* that your God
actually exists (unevidenced, of course, to us) and that he is
the correct god (again, unevidenced). We can deny both those
premises on the fact that you've failed (like in #6 and #7) to
prove them.
However, it's more interesting to work within the premise and
parameters you provide. If your God does exist and we "play by
your rules", it would seem that #8 is also a statement of malice.
You should clearly know by the printed doctrine of the Christian
death cult that:
"Judge not, lest you be judged"
This is a general teaching that those who judge should always be
mindful that an unjust judgement by you will be noticed by
others, and they will see that your carelessness in judgement is
applied back against you when you are next judged.
The scripture that you also subscribe to clearly states that one
must "judge a righteous judgement".
It is clear, by not only your judgement against Richard that he
will "go to hell" but also by giving it your blessing, that you
have performed an unjust judgement.
Will you be courageous enough to apologise, Clayton?
Rod "...or will you let your hateful and spiteful judgements and
accusations and comments stand, showing you to be an intolerant
and foolish bigot?" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * ASCII stupid question. Get a stupid ANSI!!!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: George Mooth
|Sub: Our Daily Bread
|Date: 21 Dec 96 10:32:10
EID:ea90 21955400
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb4c2a
On 08-08-96 at 11:20, GEORGE MOOTH wrote to ALL:
GM> NO TROUBLE
GM> The new believer was surprised. "Troublemakers? Why would a
GM> Christian be a troublemaker?"
GM> Why, indeed! That man may not yet have had much biblical
GM> training, but he knew one truth for sure: The term Christian
GM> troublemaker is an oxymoron. Those two words shouldn't go
GM> together.
Of course, Christians given government office, or political
power, are indeed troublesome trouble*makers*.
Here's a few examples: Colorado Amendment 2, Oregon Proposition
9, OCA, ICA, Hawaii's Future Today, etc, etc...
GM> NEVER INVITE TROUBLE -
GM> IT ALWAYS ACCEPTS!
Does that mean we should eliminate the troublemaking Christian
death-cultists? Great!
Rod "...kill yourself for Jesus" Swift.
* SLMR 2.1 * C code. C code run. Run code run.
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: George Mooth
|Sub: Our Daily Bread
|Date: 21 Dec 96 10:34:12
EID:ea90 21955440
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb4ca4
On 09-08-96 at 13:06, GEORGE MOOTH wrote to ALL:
GM> LOCKED OUT!
GM> As I sat there for several hours, I thought about how dreadful
GM> it will be for all who are "locked out" of heaven for eternity.
GM> IT'S NEVER TOO EARLY TO RECEIVE CHRIST,
GM> BUT AT ANY MOMENT IT COULD BE TOO LATE!
I believe in a God that doesn't require heavy financing.
-- Chevy Chase, "Fletch Lives".
Do you, Mooth?
Rod "... Praise Jesus and pass the chequebook!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * When in trouble or in doubt, run around, scream and shout
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 21 Dec 96 11:25:16
EID:45ad 21955b20
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb589c
On 11-08-96 at 20:14, JIM STAAL wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
JS> JS> No, I wasn't aware that 'having sex with children, polygamy,
JS> JS> rape, and brainwashing are now considered "Not hurting
JS> JS> anyone".'
JS> RS> Well, you were the one that said that they weren't hurting anyone
. .
JS> RS> . others merely pointed out that they WERE hurting people, and in
JS> RS> these ways.
JS> My point was that Reno or us didn't know that till after the fact.
Bullshit. Many ex-Davidians had reported the acts perpetrated
inside the cult's ranks. There'd even been quite indepth
journalist reports into the cult's activities, the division and
rift that formed that led Vernon Howell to the leadership of the
cult and the ousting of previous cult leaders, etc, etc.
I just thought I'd correct your mistake, Jim.
Rod "...because that's what love does, brother!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Land rights for gay whales!
--- Maximus 2.02
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: My Summer Weekend
|Date: 21 Dec 96 11:26:18
EID:f6b8 21955b40
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb58da
On 11-08-96 at 20:18, JIM STAAL wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
JS> RS> run away, Jimson . . . run away . . .
JS> Don't think so, dude. The head bully in the biker bar I was in this
JS> week bought me a brewski 5 minutes after I walked in, and I didn't
even
JS> have a word with him. Ahhh...sweet respect...
Was it the Blue Oyster bar, perchance?
Rod "... Proc-tooooooooooooooor!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * A paranoid person is someone with all the facts.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 21 Dec 96 11:27:20
EID:45ad 21955b60
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb5918
On 11-08-96 at 20:28, JIM STAAL wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
JS> RS> You know,
JS> RS> like you guessing that I am overweight and out of shape . . .
JS> You are the one who pointed that out.
You are the one who quoted John 7:24. You know.... "Don't judge
on appearances".
You know what they say about *un*righteous judgement, and
judgement itself?
Rod "...you're going to hell, sinner!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Cause of crash: Inadvertent contact with the ground.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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PATH: 690/660 396/1 124/1 9005
|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: My Summer Weekend
|Date: 21 Dec 96 11:29:22
EID:f6b8 21955ba0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb5992
On 11-08-96 at 20:32, JIM STAAL wrote to LUKE CLARK:
JS> On (01 Aug 96) Luke Clark wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> LC> Marijuana and other substances are illegal.The government has
NO
JS> LC> right whatsoever to tell people what they can and can not put
into
JS> LC> their bodies.
JS> They have the right, but I do agree that the government cannot legislate
JS> morality, and that, inasmuch as it does no harm to someone else, the
JS> country wouldl be better off financially if the drug laws were relaxed
JS> in regards to use and possession.
So you believe that all laws against criminalising the sexual
acts of gay people practiced in private settings should be also
removed?
How about the removal of bans against recognising same-gender
marriages as legally binding unions in civil law? Or will gay
people of religion (and irreligion, who wish civil marriage) be
still denied their religious and/or civil freedoms?
Rod "... hmmm. Interesting!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Cutting remarks don't cut any ice.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Satan a daddy?
|Date: 21 Dec 96 12:05:24
EID:5cb4 219560a0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb6204
On 12-08-96 at 12:16, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
CD> RS> To plan, will, and NOT DO is will-depleting,
CD> RS> Richard
CD> RS> Smith
CD> Change your signoff!
Screw you! :)
Rod "... you holier-than-thou piece of shit!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Let's support Less Characters sent in Echoes Year 1993!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Treating Aids???
|Date: 21 Dec 96 12:06:26
EID:9194 219560c0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb6242
On 12-08-96 at 12:16, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to KARL SCHNEIDER:
CD> KS> * OLX 2.2 * If a fundy divorces his wife, is she still his
CD> KS> cousin?
CD> I just don't believe Jesus would use you to speak to me like that!
I just don't believe Jesus would use you to speak to us. In
any way whatsoever!
Rod "...or he must be really desperate to get his message out to
use someone as inept as you to spread His Word! ROFL!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * The only substitute for good manners is fast reflexes.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Clayton Davis
|Sub: Treating Aids???
|Date: 21 Dec 96 12:07:28
EID:9194 219560e0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb6280
On 12-08-96 at 12:16, CLAYTON DAVIS wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
CD> RS> To plan, will, and NOT DO is will-depleting,
CD> Why, gosh! You're the smartest person who ever talked to me!
That's right. Most intelligent people ignore you.
Rod "...you're worthless. Commit suicide, Clayton, for the sake
of humanity and your god" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Dieting is a time of waist.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1 2342
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Clergy Buggering
|Date: 21 Dec 96 12:42:30
EID:182d 21956540
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb6ab6
On 12-08-96 at 17:13, DAN CEPPA wrote to ALL:
DC> From: Peninsula Daily News 8/12/96
DC> Church Wants Gag Order in Molest Case
[snippetty]
DC> The diocese later admitted that McGreal was aslo allegedly a
DC> pedophile. He had been twice to the church's treatment center
DC> for pedophiles in Jemez Springs, NM
DC> [..]
Dan, don't you find it a sad indictment that the church has a
centre set up to deal with pedophiles? Sounds like they have an
awful lot of them...
What sick bastards, these religious types are...
Rod "...meanwhile the victims go on uncompensated by the church
for the loss of their innocence to filthy sexual predators...!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Don't play stupid with me! I'm better at it.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: J.J. Hitt
|Sub: Goodbye /1 02
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:03:32
EID:c143 21957060
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb7db4
On 12-08-96 at 23:19, J.J. HITT wrote to AL SCHROEDER:
JH> AS> Neither shall _I_ be pushed arond, bullied, or controlled.
JH> AS> Or silenced, either.
JH> Try universally ignored.
I find it ironic that Al protests so much when we even make
suggestions on how to act ethically -- note *suggest*.
But when he bombastically interferes in the privacy and life of
David R, he claims that he's acting justly and ethically.
The worst thing is that he's posted a few "suck up" messages to
me. Thank goodness I can learn the lesson NOW that he's
dangerous to share personal information with.
Rod "...anyone notice the irony?" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Anything free is worth what you pay for it.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Luiz Constantino
|Sub: Re: Holysmoke.
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:14:34
EID:c6e8 219571c0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb804a
On 13-08-96 at 12:26, LUIZ CONSTANTINO wrote to CORIDON HENSHAW:
LC> Lesson 1:
LC> "I should have none."
LC> is really spelt
LC> "I should have known."
..."Spelled" is really spelled "spelled".
Rod "...AP style-guide in hand" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Bugger me with a pitch fork!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Goodbye /2
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:19:36
EID:a317 21957260
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb8178
On 13-08-96 at 18:03, JIM STAAL wrote to KEVIN CLAPP:
JS> On (11 Aug 96) Kevin Clapp wrote to DON MARTIN...
JS> KC> it would appear that *SOME* people will do most anything for 'laughs'
JS> KC> and/or 'attention'...
JS> Hello! You rubbed the lamp and here I am, dude!
JS> ... Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. (Eph 5:10)
I never knew the lord was interested in lowest common
denominators :)
Rod "...why is it that Christianity never gets any intelligent
converts?" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * That tagline is *true* ---> <--- That tagline is *false*
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Goodbye /1 02
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:20:38
EID:6fcd 21957280
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb81b6
On 13-08-96 at 18:08, JIM STAAL wrote to AL SCHROEDER:
JS> AS> Ad hominen attacks and lies, Katherine. You disappoint me more
and
JS> AS> more.
JS> Tsk, Al. Even though you have been/are the most mild mannered individual
JS> I have met here (epitomized by your very gracious 'good bye message',
The goodbye might have been gracious, but it was not honest --
and he certainly hasn't learned anything about the value of
privacy and ethics.
JS> I must say you must live on a pink cloud to have let yourself been deluded
JS> by these women. Their general purpose here has been clear to me from
the
JS> beginning: they hate men in general, and Christian men in particular.
They're FEMINAZIS huh?
Rod "...oh, cry me a river, Limbot!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Did you expect mere proof to sway my opinion?
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Karl Schneider
|Sub: Science or evolution?
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:22:40
EID:277e 219572c0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb8230
On 13-08-96 at 19:33, KARL SCHNEIDER wrote to LAURIE APPLETON:
KS> You ignorant, feeble-minded piece of offal, you are the most
KS> brain-dead asshole I have ever had the misfortune to encounter.
KS> GO FUCK YOURSELF.
The mental picture of that is exciting :)
KS> NOBODY ELSE WOULD LET YOU.
I've offered to stop saving his anal virginity for Jesus. :)
KS> You don't even have the FOGGIEST FUCKING CLUE about ANYTHING in the
KS> United States.
That's right, because he's an ignoramus.
KS> Eat shit and die, you motherfucking prick.
I'd say that's an insult to his mother :) Then again, she's
probably as ashamed of Laurie being her offspring as we are that
he is of the same genus as ourselves.
Rod "...It's called guilt *from* association :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Smoke me a kipper skipper, I'll be back for breakfast!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: J.J. Hitt
|Sub: Hot L
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:38:42
EID:f594 219574c0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb85f2
On 13-08-96 at 11:47, J.J. HITT wrote to KATHERINE WINTERSNIGHT:
JH> One final note on our recent discussion of cheap motels:
JH> The place I stayed at in Dallas earlier this year is in the
JH> news today.
JH> They had a fire which killed ten people.
It was the wrath of Jaysus punishin' all those adulteratin'
sinners. FORNICATOOOOOORS!
Rod "...I wonder if Pat Robertson sounded like this when he
redirected that hurricane? :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Idleness is the holiday of fools.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: 2 Cor 2:9 (NKJV) [Our Da
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:41:44
EID:98ed 21957520
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb86a8
On 13-08-96 at 17:40, KEN WIENS wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
KW> RS>On Saturday -- that was St. Valentine's Day [1349], they
KW> RS>burnt the Jews on a wooden platform in their cemetary.There were
KW> RS>about two thousand people of them.
KW> I know you have provided a number of examples of acts from
KW> history by those who called themselves christians. Fortunately,
KW> all one has to do is contrast these acts with the biblical
KW> definition of a christian.
Is Pat Robertson a Christian?
Sen Jesse Helms?
Colin Powell?
Flip Benham?
Ralph Reed?
Jerry Falwell?
Ex-Rep Robert K Dornan?
Jack Hoag?
Lou Sheldon?
Phyllis Schlafly?
D James Kennedy?
Please, a concise yes or no, and a reason why if no, thank you.
Rod "...awaiting in anticipation..." Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * All general statements are false.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Ed Mills
|Sub: Homophobia
|Date: 21 Dec 96 14:49:46
EID:f5e8 21957620
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb888a
On 12-08-96 at 23:38, ED MILLS wrote to ALL:
EM> Today, on the Dr. Dean Edell radio show, I heard something
that
EM> supports a suspicion I've had for years. It's old hat, the idea
that
EM> homophobia is a manifestation of repressed homosexuality. Everyone's
EM> heard the postulate, but today, some very telling evidence came
to
EM> light at the University of Georgia.
EM> A group of professed heterosexual men was queried as to their
EM> feelings about homosexuality. They were then connected to a "penile
EM> turgidity" measuring instrument - some kind of micrometer connected
to
EM> a computer. They were then made to view gay porn videos while the
EM> instrument monitored their schwantzes for "turgidity."
EM> Guess who got the substantial majority of the hardons during
the
EM> test? The men who professed revulsion for homosexuality, of course!
Those tests were reproduced this week. Heterosexual college-aged
males were classified by reactions to questions -- whether they
had a dislike for gays, whether they wanted to imprison gays, or
have them exterminated, or whether they were ok with gay people, or
supported equality for gay people. They were also asked to
answer questions about their reaction to gays propositioning them
-- violent or not.
They were divided into two groups -- gay-neutral or supportive,
and condemnatory or violently hostile.
All were subjected to video screenings of gay sexual scenes.
Of the neutral or supportive group, 34% of the subjects had an
erectile response to the homosexual videos. Of the violent or
hostile group, 80% of the men had erectile response.
This has further expanded the theory that the people with
*violent* hatred or condemnation of gay people or homosexuality
do so out of fear that they could possibly be gay.
Rod "... interesting result, no?" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * You're so unhip it's a wonder your bum doesn't fall off!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Educational Experienc
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:06:48
EID:fa3a 219578c0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb8c88
On 13-08-96 at 18:50, DAN CEPPA wrote to RICHARD SMITH:
DC> There should be 2 other messages from me in this packet based on
DC> his "xian lovingness" about the 'gooks' in Viet Nam. One to
DC> him directly and another based on that to ALL.
DC> This fucking bastard hides behind his cloak of xianity. He
DC> decries, "Bad fumes!", "Not what I said", "I'm trying to be
DC> good!"
DC> Thing is, they buy it and excuse his personal belief in a
DC> "personal saviour" and let the piece of shit continue to
DC> be the bigoted asshole that he is.
DC> To me, his actions are unpardonable with his attitude
DC> after the fact. There is nothing evident that he as a
DC> brain, let alone a single working brain cell.
DC> As it stands, I'd like to see a show of hands from the Xian
DC> camp that support him. Well, Jesse, are you going to join
DC> in on this? What about you. Mikey. Or, Al, your back now...
DC> Care to comment?
Maybe if they all come on board and support Jimbot here, we can
get Jimbot to say other racially-incorrect words like:
spic negro jap wog
coon nigger chink slanteye
kraut eyetie frog etc, etc, etc
Rod "Remember, cyberbear loves you! He's your online personal
pal at: http://www.thecorporation.com/archive/archive.html" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * C programmer run, C programmer crash, C programmer quit.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Goodbye /2 02
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:16:50
EID:bf9a 21957a00
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb8ee2
On 13-08-96 at 08:28, RICHARD SMITH wrote to KATHERINE WINTERSNIGHT:
RS> JS> I just am marveling over seeing the reaction to 'h' word
RS> JS> being on the other foot. Ahhh....
RS> . . . it is a good mouse, George, a very good mouse. Not as good as
RS> rabbits, though. I like ketchup with my beans. When are we gonna
get
RS> the rabbits again, George? Uh, George? Can I take care of the
RS> rabbits?
Imagine what Jim will be like when he discovers his penis, Richard:
... Huh, George, can I pull it again George? When
are we going to be pulling them again, George? Uh,
George? Can I pull it now?
Rod "...one day he might get around to dick-scovering it" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * That tagline is *true* ---> <--- That tagline is *false*
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Satan a daddy?
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:18:52
EID:efaa 21957a40
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb8f5c
On 13-08-96 at 08:39, RICHARD SMITH wrote to KARL SCHNEIDER:
RS> JH> I've said it before, and I'll say it again.....
RS> JH> What the hell are you on?
RS> KS> Definitely not his rocker...
RS> I think it's spanish fly. Fercryingoutloud, keep him away from me .
. . };)
RS> It's nice to be asked, but Holey Moley, I'm straight . . .
Damn..!!!!!! :)
Rod "...and it was such a fatal attraction for a while :) And I
mean that in a full motion, pictorial, cinematic sense" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Expert: Anyone from out of town.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Al Schroeder
|Sub: the other shoe
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:29:54
EID:d536 21957ba0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb91f2
On 13-08-96 at 00:06, AL SCHROEDER wrote to MARILYN BURGE:
AS> Do I want them to live in pain? No. But given the advances made in
the
AS> last ten years in AIDS treatment, it seems an odd time to give up.
Would I
AS> advise them to...if possible...hang on for as much as they can stand,
to
AS> see if a cure would be developed? Yes. And that line differs for each
AS> person. Do I want them to live in constant pain? No. Do I think there
is
AS> such a point? Yes. Do I urge caution before making a decision that
is
AS> irrevocable?
AS> Yes.
AS> It would be awful to have someone commit suicide because they were
AIDS
AS> positive, and for their lover, or sibling, or whatever to hear of an
AIDS
AS> cure the next year...a year which many AIDS patients endure.
This melodramatic clap-trap still does not validate the fact that
you deprived David of his LIBERTIES of choice and control over
his own affairs.
Your interference meant you played god with another person's
life, and now the lives of a number of people. You have lost all
respect earned in the views of others because of your unethical
behaviour.
If you had done this same thing to me, I would be castigating you
further than I am now.
What right did you have to play God? What right did you have for
YOUR choices to override David's choices? What right did you
have to usurp David's decisions and choices and institute your
own?
What right did you have in telling others about David, rather
than David doing it on his own time, and in his own way -- if
necessary at all?
Now, after answering all those questions, reanswer them
substituting "RESPONSIBILITY" for "RIGHT"
You will find you are NOT responsible for David's life,
happiness, or choices. Ergo, you should not override them.
Your actions are an insult to all other humans who value their
freedom, Al.
Rod "... if you'd abused my freedoms and choices the way you have
done with David, I'd not be wanting to commit suicide anymore,
but retribution..." Swift :(
* SLMR 2.1 * To every exception there is a rule.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: David Rice
|Sub: Dragonfest 1996
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:37:56
EID:8573 21957ca0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb93d4
On 14-08-96 at 11:39, DAVID RICE wrote to ALL:
[...lotsa snippety snip... bobbitt here and there...]
DR> Then I ran into Gwenny the Pooh, which surprised her---
DR> she had not expected me to be there. At all three times we
DR> met during the festival, she asked me "Have you met my
DR> husband?" Goddess, how many hundreds of women have asked
DR> me that very same question?! When she asked me where my
DR> tent was I gave her a decoy location. Tee hee. (I can
DR> imagine some innocent couple being surprised late at night
DR> by Gwenny stealthily entering their tent looking for
DR> me....)
This sounded like a real fun event. Something my paganistic
partner might like to attend, if given the opportunity. Hey, and
hell, I'll attend if it helps me attune :)
Rod "...so why the Gwenny diversion??? :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * The only rose without thorns is friendship.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Ryan Shaw
|Sub: the promise keepers
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:41:58
EID:d4bd 21957d20
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb94c6
On 14-08-96 at 15:47, RYAN SHAW wrote to ALL:
[...a letter about the promisefilth from...]
RS> JACK T. SANDERS
RS> Eugene
RS> /---/
RS> reprinted without permission of course. fuck 'em.
RS> /---/
RS> the author of the letter states that we need to investigate this thing.
RS> forget about that, it *already* stinks of corruption, not
RS> to mention the flagrant use of mind control to urge people
RS> to donate money. from what i read in the paper huge
RS> buckets were passed around at the end of the last day of
RS> the crusade for donations. this is in *addition* to the
RS> $60 fee, a fee that was slightly too steep for this poor
RS> college student. otherwise i would have been there --- to
RS> do some investigation of my own.
Ryan:
Get on the usenet newsgroups and seek alt.org.promisekeepers.
When you get there, tell them that godless heathen Rod Swift sent
you, and ask them to give you the same offer as they did me -- a
free ticket.
Tell them it's their Christian charitable responsibility to
provide you with 2 tickets, and airfares, to a Promisekeeper's
conference in .
When they don't offer to do it, call them "pathetic, false
Christians only seeking to make money out of people, rather than
bring people to Christ".
You may get 2 tickets and some free flights :)
Rod "... always helpful..." Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * And don't start a sentence with a conjunction.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Sam
|Sub: Our Daily Bread
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:46:00
EID:44a5 21957dc0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb95b8
On 14-08-96 at 23:36, SAM wrote to GRAYHAWK:
SA> G> Jesus, like Elvis, is dead and buried and rotting in the basement...
SA> The question is:
SA> Who's basement?
Regis Philbin's...
Regis had liberated Elvis from Kathy Lee's basement, where he was
working on her new fall line :)
Rod "...can anyone spell 'Kathy Lee Paradise'? :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * D.A.M.: Mothers Against Dyslexia.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Sue Armstrong
|Sub: A God
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:50:02
EID:adca 21957e40
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb96aa
On 12-08-96 at 07:26, SUE ARMSTRONG wrote to MARTIN GOLDBERG:
SA> ... Baldrick, how did you get so much custard out of such a small cat?
I have this as a .wav file....!
Want it, Sue???
Rod "... let's trade on IRC! :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * An oyster is a fish built like a nut.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: Scanner
|Date: 21 Dec 96 15:53:04
EID:54ea 21957ea0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb9760
On 14-08-96 at 20:50, MARILYN BURGE wrote to ALL:
MB> Does somebody out there has a really high-quality scanner?
I have access to one.
MB> If so, I have an ICR tract that I'm dying to have scanned
MB> so it can be added to the HOLYSMOKE homepage. This tract
MB> is just too, too precious! Unfortunately, all I have is a
MB> machine copy of the original, so the better quality scanner
MB> we use, the better. The illustration on the front page of
MB> the tract is the best part of all. In essence, it blames
MB> humanism for abortion, pediphilia, assisted suicide, porn,
MB> and every other conceivable "evil" our culture enjoys. Ya
MB> gotta love those ever-lovin' Christers. They're a laugh a
MB> minute -- especially when the find an "enemy" they can pin
MB> every evil on, the same as they try to find a one-note
MB> "cure" for all those same evils (finding ghod, of course).
If you want to send it this way, you can. I suggest sending a
copy, not the original, or vice versa...
Rod "... you know US SNAIL... :(" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * He's your God, they're your rules, YOU burn in hell!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Imagine
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:13:06
EID:19d2 219581a0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bb9c12
On 14-08-96 at 17:47, DAN CEPPA wrote to JESSE JONES:
DC> Without your little book to tell you what to do, you can't even
DC> go to the bathroom in the correct manner. (Yes, Jesse, it's there.)
DC> Most likely you "sin" each and every time you defecate, especially
DC> on the Sabbath, perhaps not on the Sunday that you hold to be the
DC> 'correct' day of worhip.
Now, how many miles must we run away from the city and dig a
hole, again? :) :)
DC> Be ever so proud of turning off your mind to be a slave to your
DC> religion. It's the only way you think that you must be a slave
DC> to do good deeds.
*Rod puts on a plastic smile and beams widely*
Don't ask questions, convert, just PRAISE JESUS!
Rod "...ugh. Christian right-winger types are so fucked up,
Dan!" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * ...Pro-life? Then GET ONE and STAY THE FUCK OUT OF MINE!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: J.J. Hitt
|Sub: Re: Yahweh sent me some
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:34:08
EID:1ffa 21958440
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba100
On 15-08-96 at 11:37, J.J. HITT wrote to JASON HARMON:
JH> (I've been busy with watching the Republican Variety Hour and
JH> haven't yet read the material I got in the mail.)
There's variety among Re-pubic-cants? I thought they were all
proudly white, straight, and womanhating :) And they like
porkbarelling big business with corporate welfare :) :)
God forbid that they let the Log Cabin Republi-can'ts speak :)
Rod "...big tent, my ass!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * The only rational solution to your problem is suicide.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Your Daily Brother Jim
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:41:10
EID:8a8f 21958520
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba2a6
On 15-08-96 at 18:02, JIM STAAL wrote to DAVID RICE:
JS> DR> 4) Was "Agent Orange" the tool of "heros" or
JS> DR> evil, demonic, don't-care-whom-we-kill-with-
JS> DR> lingering-misery asshole bastards who consider
JS> DR> life a cheap comodity in return for economic
JS> DR> gains? If so, what makes you believe so?
JS> Agent Orange was a defoiliant, not an anti-personal weapon.
Isn't fire a defoliant? Use that :)
Are you willing to admit that Agent Orange was used for more
destructive purposes such as enemy anti-personnel attacks?
Then again, this is exactly the sort of stuff that makes me think
you're head isn't filled with brain cells. In fact...
Rod "... I can't believe that it *IS* butter" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * An unemployed court jester is no one's fool.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Goodbye /1
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:42:12
EID:891b 21958540
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba2e4
On 15-08-96 at 18:10, JIM STAAL wrote to AL SCHROEDER:
JS> I can dig it. I have found that enduring 'Staal bashing' is second
JS> nature by now. :)
Since you so generously request it...
JS> ... Mom said carrots are good for my eyes, but it hurts when I insert
'em.
Didn't your mother tell you they were good for haemorrhoids?
Start shoving away... Trust me, it doesn't hurt at all :) :)
Rod "...*evil grin*..." Swift.
* SLMR 2.1 * Roses are red, violets smell nice - Poet without a clue.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: My Rummer Weekend
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:47:14
EID:7f74 219585e0
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba412
On 15-08-96 at 12:05, MARTY LEIPZIG wrote to LYNDA BUSTILLOZ:
ML> ... Just exactly how much 'Whiz' is in Cheese Whiz?
How much cheese is in there, for gawdsake?
Rod "... I don't know!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * To be or not to be. Ever think about that?
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: Believer
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:52:16
EID:0176 21958680
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba540
On 16-08-96 at 06:12, MARTY LEIPZIG wrote to DAN CEPPA:
ML> ... Jesus saves, Moses invests, the Bagwhan spends and the Mongol hordes
Ugh, the Bagwhan. What a bastard... He and his little orangie
cult tried to take over the South West of Western Australia, before
the locals kicked him and his bitch-offsider Mah Sheela out.
Rod "... Rajneeshies are NOT popular around WA :)" Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Click. Click. Click. Damn... Out of taglines!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: the other shoe
|Date: 21 Dec 96 16:59:18
EID:b68d 21958760
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba6e6
On 15-08-96 at 21:19, MARILYN BURGE wrote to AL SCHROEDER:
MB> Who are you to think that your judgment is so superior to somebody
MB> else's? I thought Christians were supposed to be humble. You might
MB> try it sometime.
He was playing god. Pure and simple. He was wrong.
MB> And, in closing, if you EVER relay anything I say on this echo to
MB> ANY person I know, no matter how noble you may think you are being,
MB> I'll do everything I can to make the rest of your life a living
MB> hell. Understand? I certainly hope so, for your sake.
A-fucking-men, and same from me! I feel saddened because you
other holysmokers have probably shared things with Al that are
sensitive in nature. I have been luckily spared from that fate.
Until Al learns ethical behaviour, the abuse of people's privacy
by his bombastic squeals of Christian righteousness will
invariably wreck any trust we have ever had in him having ethical
and moral behaviour.
Rod "...I will not be having any conversations with Al of a
personal nature at all..." Swift
* SLMR 2.1 * Dyslexic agnostics don't know whether there is a dog!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Karl Schneider
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 21 Dec 96 17:11:20
EID:bb9e 21958960
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bba9b8
On 16-08-96 at 07:58, KARL SCHNEIDER wrote to JIM STAAL:
KS> JS>Thank you. Basically, it consists of visiting a discusting place
(the
KS> JS>police station), getting a form, researching the court dockets of
1978
KS> Ah. The police station is a disgusting place.
KS> But you hang out in biker bars.
KS> Figures.
You have a better chance of getting some rough 'n' ready sex from
the Blue Oyster bar than the local cop shop :) :)
Rod "...I left my heart in San Francisco." Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * If it stinks, it's chemistry.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Glen Todd
|Sub: satanism
|Date: 21 Dec 96 17:18:22
EID:8193 21958a40
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bbab5e
On 16-08-96 at 09:25, GLEN TODD wrote to KEN WIENS:
GT> ... "Oh, bother", said Pooh, as the BATF destroyed his honey pot.
No no no!!!
Staal will tell you that it was that EEEVIL FEMINAZI Janet Reno
who destroyed Pooh's honeypot!!!!
Rod "...ROFLing" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * Cause of crash: Inadvertent contact with the ground.
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Rod Swift
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Educational Experienc
|Date: 21 Dec 96 17:35:24
EID:edb4 21958c60
MSGID: 3:690/660.0 32bbaf5c
On 16-08-96 at 13:40, JIM STAAL wrote to RYAN SHAW:
JS> JS> JS> You were in Vietnam?
JS> JS> DC> If he was, it was _Viet Nam_, "English Major".
JS> KS> JS>So what has that to do with speaking/spelling Gook, eh?
JS> KS> You really are an asshole.
JS> JS> You really get to be at a loss for words, don't you?
JS> rs> he's right, you racist asshole.
JS> Racist? In what manner?
Can you please explain the context and meaning of the word "gook"
as you have used it above?
Did you use it as a perjorative against people of Asian ethnicity?
If you did, you're a racist asshole :)
If you did NOT, please do tell us how you did mean to use it! :)
Rod "...and in answerin' the question: no stallin' Staalin!" Swift :)
* SLMR 2.1 * If it isn't broken, then fix it anyway!
--- Maximus 2.02
* Origin: Perth Omen BBS -- FASTER LIVE InterNet (+619) 244 2111 (3:690/660)
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|From: Jack Kinney
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Billy "Liar" Wolff
|Date: 26 Dec 96 15:18:23
EID:c0e8 219a7a40
MSGID: 1:123/67 32c29753
REPLY: 1:124/9005.221 72a9aada
PID: GED3 2.51.a901 124LM3
25 Dec 96 13:08, quoting Martin Goldberg to ALL:
MG> Doews anyone have any idea what is wrong with this guy?
He seems perfectly normal to me.
--- GodEdit 0.00
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop (1:123/67)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Andrew Masten
|Sub: "Flat Earth" Town
|Date: 26 Dec 96 19:56:12
EID:1fcc 219a9f00
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 c75e8532
On (22 Dec 96) Andrew Masten got back to Karen Davis...
AM> asked the Father to forgive them of the particular sin of
AM> crucifying Him.
KD> How could it have been a sin if it was what God wanted?
AM> What God wanted was to buy back the human race, not the death of
Why'd he sell the human race in the first place? Did he make
a prophet the first time around?
AM> His Son via the torture of crucifixtion. This is the crux of the
AM> gospel.. that God so loved the world that He was willing to give
AM> His only Son that whosoever should believe in Him should not
What do you mean, "give". He got him right back. Try understanding
what the word 'sacrifice' means.
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: Another Quantum Baitshop Franchise! (1:123/67.5)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Steve Hayes
|Sub: atheistic bombast
|Date: 26 Dec 96 19:56:39
EID:1976 219a9f00
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 81cc21cd
On (22 Dec 96) Steve Hayes got back to Dan Ceppa...
SS> Why does ANYONE need to be saved? Please be specific. I have yet
SS> to have a christian answer this simple question.
SH> Much the same answer as you would get to the question "Why does anyone
SH> need a liver?"
SH> The answer depends on the assumptions you make about life, the
SH> universe and everything, and the answer isn't always 42.
SH> Christians believe that God made the world and made it good. But when
SH> Christians believe that this evil, or sin, is not just a random
SH> Christians believe that the world is in effect one big concentration
SH> Christians believe that God did not want to leave the world in the
SH> Chrsitians believe that Jesus has bound the devil, and broken down the
So, you believe a bunch of silly things. Now, provide evidence that
any of them is factual.
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: Another Quantum Baitshop Franchise! (1:123/67.5)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1 2342
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: fundy clown
|Date: 26 Dec 96 19:57:09
EID:3460 219a9f20
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 9d871635
On (24 Dec 96) Marty Leipzig got back to David Worrell...
ML> Yeah, but squirrel pelts and loads of empty beer cans are
ML> not considered legal tender.
DW> They are if you're a resident of the abovementioned states.
ML> Damn, by that standard, Staal's a fucking tycoon.
Marty, you mispelled 'buffoon'.
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: Another Quantum Baitshop Franchise! (1:123/67.5)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Musselwhite
|Sub: Catastrophism (b)
|Date: 26 Dec 96 19:57:35
EID:9031 219a9f20
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3e9ccd92
On (22 Dec 96) John Musselwhite got back to Laurie Appleton...
JM> I've been to the Grand Canyon, Laurie... I've even taken a leak
JM> off the edge and watched it fly a mile down. The USGS geologist
Yes, but is it in your free will to be able to piss one mile up?
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: Another Quantum Baitshop Franchise! (1:123/67.5)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Laurie Appleton
|Sub: Darrow Nonsense (b)
|Date: 26 Dec 96 19:58:05
EID:2d26 219a9f40
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 b99284fa
On (24 Dec 96) Laurie Appleton got back to Dan Ceppa...
DC> You know nothing of the reason for the trial and why
DC> Darrow was there in the first place.
LA> Well, just let