God Damned Fundies!
|From: Ed Mills
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: In the news
|Date: 09 Mar 97 09:51:26
EID:3de5 22694e60
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 8a85f7a5
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 331c112c
Rod Swift sD "Hi, s!" Ė Steve Quarrella, ĖHs:
SQ> Oh, how hateful! You hate Christians!
RS> We love Christians. We want them to meet their maker Real Soon
RS> Now (tm) so that they can help Jesus come again, or something.
RS> *shrug* I don't get their religion. It's so stupid and
RS> internally contradictory.
That's the whole point of it. Nobody has to get it. It's based on
things that are outside the realm of reason, so it's exempt from
questioning. No assembly required.
edweird
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Cracker Barrel boycott
|Date: 09 Mar 97 09:55:50
EID:938f 22694ee0
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 1b5bc299
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 331c14b4
Rod Swift sD "Hi, s!" Ė Marilyn Burge, ĖHs:
RS> * On 27-02-97 at 04:50, MARILYN BURGE wrote to KEN YOUNG,
RS> on the topic of "Cracker Barrel boycott" in echo Holysmoke:
MB> KY> Gays will go to Hell if they are not saved, and if you are
MB> KY> gay, you cannot be saved.
It's good to know that there are people who cannot be saved, whether
they choose to or not. I hope you'll include me in that group.
edweird
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Irc Log Fun!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:17:06
EID:6d06 22696a20
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 9a4e5c00
REPLY: 1:228/45.5 3c0a6af2
Jim Staal sD "Hi, s!" Ė Fredric Rice, ĖHs:
FR> You're 100% willful slave to hatred.
JS> You are really the _only_ hateful person on this echo. You hate God,
JS> His Christ, and anyone who bears the name Christian.
Nah. What he hates is the criminal behaviour so routinely perpetrated
by adherents of the abovementioned delusions.
edweird
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Lon Mabon
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:20:25
EID:e232 22696a80
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 375c4419
REPLY: 1:228/45.5 29c0d467
Jim Staal sD "Hi, s!" Ė Fredric Rice, ĖHs:
FR> Why do you use Lon S. Mabon's name? Could it be because you're in
FR> agreement with his traditional Christianity as outlined above, pig?
JS> The correct question was 'why _did_ I use the name Lon S. Mabon.
JS> (there is no such person).
Aha. There is a god, a holy ghost and a saviour, (for all of which
there is no evidence) but there is no Lon Mabon.
And all this time I thought the opposite. :)
edweird
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Anthony Grigor-Scott
|Sub: clones
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:37:07
EID:58c6 22696ca0
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 a50fae79
REPLY: 3:711/933 332061b2
Anthony Grigor-Scott sD "Hi, s!" Ė Lynda Bustilloz, ĖHs:
AG> Dear Lynda Bustilloz,
AG> Christian greetings in the precious Name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
LB> They can now successfully clone a mammal...humans are mammals. Will
a
LB> cloned human be regarded as having a soul?
AG> That's an interesting question. I did not bother to read how the beast
AG> was actually produced and until I know I cannot speculate.
AG> Nonetheless, it was not a creation but a product of creation.
Too bad god isn't omniscient. Think of all the trouble he could
have prevented.
edweird
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|From: Marilyn Burge
|To: Alan Hess
|Sub: You forgot to answer this...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 08:37:29
EID:21e2 226944a0
MSGID: 1:105/302.666 d625cf79
On (01 Mar 97) Alan Hess babbled to Ken Young...
AH> Whilst masticating on , Ken Young (1:270/420)
AH> wrote to Alan Hess:
KY>> Nope.. Now, if they switched to Messianic Jew, on the other
KY>> hand, that would be another story..
AH>> A so-called Messianic Jew is a Christian, not a Jew.
KY> One can't be a Christian Jew?
AH> No. The two are mutually exclusive.
Not so. All twelve of the Disciples were Jews.
... Teenages are God's punishment for enjoying sex!
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Shelby Sherman
|To: Laurie Appleton
|Sub: Harry Truman.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:06:41
EID:11a7 226958c0
MSGID: 1:123/67 33229a27
REPLY: 3:640/238@Fidonet 89a15389
PID: GED3 2.51.a901 124LM3
08 Mar 97 10:39, quoting Laurie Appleton to Dan Ceppa:
LA> dans le re'gne anmal (1825).
^^^^^
LA> (7) Whitley, Journal of the Philosophical Society of
LA> Great Britain, XII (1910),
^^^^^
LA> Elephant (1916), p. 236.
LA> (8) J.D. Dana, Manual of Geology (4th ed.; 1894), p.1007.
^^^^^
LA> (Earth In Upheaval, Immanuel Velikovsky, 1956, p. 7)
^^^^
You're an Idiot, yaknowit?
--- GodEdit 0.00
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|From: Anthony Grigor-Scott
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Convention on the Rights
|Date: 09 Mar 97 09:43:36
EID:1b79 22694d60
MSGID: 3:711/933 332289fe
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 331afe12
Dear Rod Swift,
Christian greetings in the precious Name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
AG>> visit http:/www.biblebelievers.org.au
RS> Do you have the stuff that the Sydney Morning Herald reported
RS> about online yet at the web site?
Other people have it on-line. It is hardly edifying as Jeremy Jones of the
Board of Jewish Deputies lied against the Talmud, then embraced
"Father" Brian Lucas of the Roman Catholic church who has frequently
been called a liar (live on air) on Sydney commercial radio and he lied
about the published objectives of the present Pope.
Together both men lied about the contents of Bible Believers BBS. The
whole article was ostensibly condemning the BBS for carrying "Nameless
War" by Captain Ramsay, a British MP who wrote TRUTH .... something far
from the experience of these men if that article is any yardstick. They
were also incensed that we carried "The Thirteenth Tribe" by a TRUTHFUL
man, an Askenazi Jew named Arthur Koestler published by Randam House and
resourced from the most eminent Jewish historians. We do not and have
never carried this book which is probably still under copyright.
Nonetheless, either book is available from your local library or through
an inter-library loan and the bookstores are happy to get them in. (I've
asked). I copied "The Nameless War" from a serialisation in the National
press three or four years ago. I read "The Thirteenth Tribe" in the macquarrie
University Library.
The HONEST purpose of the journalist, Jon Casimir, who wrote the DIShonest
article was to make a bit of a mark for himself at the expense of editorial
integrity and with no regard for truth or offending innocents, knowing the
power of the Jewish Press (as the Sydney Morning Herald was) and that there
was no redress I could take.
The HONEST purpose of the Jewish Board of Deputies was to strike a blow
for censorship of the InterNet, BBS, etc. I just happened to be a "mark"
they
could use in a cowardly way with impunity. You are another. The difference
is, you don't recognize it.
RS> * OLX 2.1 TD * If Jesus is Jewish, why does he have a Spanish name?
Jesus was not Jewish. Neither was he Spanish. His blood was the blood of
God.
Kind regards,
Anthony Grigor-Scott
visit http:/www.biblebelievers.org.au
--- GoldED/386 2.50.Beta5+
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: Laurie Appleton
|Sub: Alternative of Straw.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:32
EID:c6cf 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e50
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
LA>MG>In a weak moment I posted to you. I see that you still post with
LA>MG>messages full of lies and misquoted scientists. You are truly a
LA>MG>worthless bag of scum.
LA>You are a lying son of a bitch.
Eat shit, you lying, syphilitic afterbirth of a drunken gangfuck.
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž Nuke a gay Jesus for the baby whales.
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: You *didn't* answer this
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:33
EID:a8af 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e51
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
JS> JS> well, lets see... mcveigh supposedly admitted to doing it, they
have
JS> JS> witnesses that say they saw him rent the truck, he belonged to a
fundy
JS> JS> militia... nah, nothing that will hold up in court there...
JS>Fundy militia???? Could you be a bit more specific?
If he can't, I can. He was a regular at 'Elohim City', an enclave
of heavily-armed right-wing nutcake wacko fundy idiots about 20 miles
from me.
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž Quark: Smallest particle in universe except fundy brain.
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: Katherine Wintersnight
|Sub: clones
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:34
EID:a485 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e56
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
KW>KS>Well, 'Dolly', the first actual adult mammal clone is alive and well.
KW>KS>Coincidentally, she's a sheep.
KW>KS>I'm having a devil (oops) of a time trying to figure out what impact
KW>KS>this will have on fundys...
KW>Cheaper 'marital aids'.
Heh. I'm gonna wait for the 2nd generation where they can be 'made
to order'...
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž Fundys knee-deep in gasoline tossing matches at infidels.
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: Fredric Rice
|Sub: clones
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:34
EID:b28e 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e57
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
FR>ks> Well, 'Dolly', the first actual adult mammal clone
FR>ks> is alive and well. Coincidentally, she's a sheep.
FR>I'm wonderig why it's being considered the first. Food cows have been
cloned
FR>for the past decade.
Are you sure? I'm aware of husbandry techniques with AI etc., but
never heard of any cloning being done...
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž God not found. Deleting OMNI.*
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: J.J. Hitt
|Sub: clones
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:34
EID:e479 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e58
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
JH> KS> And, assuming they can afford it, will result in some
JH> KS> really awesome NFL teams...
JH> I doubt it will ever result in producing full fledged copies
JH> of adult human beings (it'll always be cheaper to make them
JH> the old fashioned way).
Er, you mean making a fully-grown copy? Nope I don't think *that*
will ever be done, but I would give really big odds there will be
DNA duplicate embryos within a year. Somewhere.
JH> But just think what it could do to the field of organ
JH> transplantation. No time spent waiting for a donor. No
JH> fruitless searches for a perfect tissue match. If you need a
JH> kidney or a liver ya GROW ONE. Of course, for ethical
JH> reasons, you would have to grow it in a non-human host animal.
JH> But this has now become something within the realm of the
JH> "maybe do-able".
Hell, why not grow it in a human-type body? It's just artificial
anyway...
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž I used to get stiff in the joints so I quit going to them
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: Mario Gonzalez
|Sub: clones
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:34
EID:7e21 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e59
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
MG> MG> people with no souls roaming the planet!
MG> KS> Better that than what we have now; fundys with no MINDS roaming...
MG> After all the ethical debates are over I wonder if it will be
OK
MG> to clone myself, then in maybe 12 or 20 years harvest a new
MG> heart for me and discard what is not needed
Sure. And while you're at it, download your brain to a hard drive,
then copy it back into the new brain. Repeat as needed.
(with my luck the damn drive would crash)...;>
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž Race car spelled backwards is race car.
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|From: Karl Schneider
|To: All
|Sub: BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:04:35
EID:c147 22696080
PID: OLMS 2.53 [Evaluation] 325 days
MSGID: 1:170/551.0 161d8e5b
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8609
JUST IN CASE ANYONE MISSED THIS ONE...
JS>-=> Jim Staal said, in a huffy tone of voice, to Marilyn Burge <=-
JS>Oh, I don't know. The head of a newborn is about 3-4 inches at max. My
JS>dick is longer than that and I know I have never penetrated the cervix
JS>so the head (being the last thing to come out in a breeched birth) would
JS>be beyond the cervix. Get off it, lady.
-!-
ž OLX 2.2 ž Titicaca. It's a place, not something you do.
-+- OLMS 2.53 UNREG
---
* Origin: CompuMate - Tulsa, OK (918)663-3454 (1:170/551)
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: TDHW
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:23:07
EID:5336 2268a2e0
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 51a563e7
REPLY: 1:105/302.666 ea1e546b
Marilyn Burge sD "Hi, s!" Ė Ed Mills, ĖHs:
EM> Sagan pokes great fun at the suggestibility of humans in general,
EM> and I shan't be surprised if, somewhere along the way, he takes
EM> a slice out of folks who are somehow tricked into thinking this
EM> book is a work of fiction.
EM> I guess it was the bible I was thinking of.
MB> I have a copy I haven't read yet. (GAWD! I wish "they" would
MB> offer another financial incentive to retire so's I could catch
MB> up on my reading!)
One of the perks of 2.5 hrs/day worth of Tri-Met.
Along with always being among the first in town to catch the
latest flu.
edweird
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: Don Martin
|Sub: Blavatsky?
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:26:54
EID:8154 2268a340
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 f4f37f11
REPLY: 1:261/1000.0 33216573
Don Martin sD "Hi, s!" Ė Ed Mills, ĖHs:
DM> Ed Mills said "Blavatsky?" to Don Martin, adding:
DM> Calabreeze was his name (your spelling may vary), Christopher, I
DM> think. It once was in the FAQ (of fond memory). Here is the quote
DM> (in all caps, sic) from back in '95:
DM> "FUCK YOU ATHEIST! WHEN I FIND OUT WHERE YOU LIVE, I'LL DRIVE A
DM> PITCHFORK THROUGH THAT EMPTY HEAD OF YOURS, YOU ARROGANT PIG!
What a piece of work.
Although I missed out on the more flamboyantly idiotic stuff in
recent years hereabouts, I did enjoy a medium-sized e-mail flame of
that nhorsley@pobox.com character - you know, that christiangallery
website.
In fact, I think I'll check the mail right now, while I'm
thinking of it. :)
edweird
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Ed Mills
|To: ALL
|Sub: nazi website
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:50:34
EID:2591 2268ae40
MSGID: 1:105/24.12 93f133d7
I checked out www.christiangallery.com and subsequently
took a swipe at its proprietor, nhorsley@pobox.com. The
response was predictably feeble - even by comparison to
my own debating skills, which are barely average; I shame-
lessly filched phraseology from a couple folks around here
who are more articulate than I, in addition to the Hitler
quote from... was it Ron Vass?
So, in a way, it was sort of all of us who flamed the
website guy. Hey! I'm a channeler for Holysmoke!
Please excuse the wide margins - I'm using the text
editor "StoneAxe 1.0" and itsa lotta werk.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
At 08:36 PM 3/7/97 EST, you wrote:
Well, howdy there!
Someone on the fidonet echo "Holysmoke" saw your precious little
website and posted the address so we could all have a look. (You might
want to find yourself a BBS that carries it, if you enjoy gratuitously
inflammatory debate!)
He said he put his two cents' worth in your suggestion box, which
landed him a position on your neo-Nazi hit list. I'm quite jealous. I
seriously hope you'll consider adding my name as well. It's nice to know
that such an example of typical christian hatred and dishonesty can be
viewed by anyone who has a computer. This website is a far better weapon
against religious hysteria than anything a nonbeliever could dream up!
Doesn't it just drive you nuts that, regardless of how many
heretics and witches you try to burn at the stake, your christianic
death-cult is clearly on the way out, evolutionarily speaking? It must
feel like fire-ants in your shorts, having your superstition gradually,
inexorably exposed for the fraud that it is. You've painted yourselves
into an evolutionary corner from which there is no escape. Those of us
who are taking the inevitable strides toward human understanding of
nature have already encompassed more territory than you can ever win back
with any amount of shrill, hateful rhetoric. Scream and threaten until
you are blue in the face. The forthcoming extinction of supernatural
cults has been insured by natural processes whose existence has been
CONFIRMED by rigorous, skeptical, peer-reviewed science. Feel free to
screech at the top of your hysterical lungs; "nature careth not one
bit," to paraphrase Galileo.
I am particularly amused by the sanctimonious shrieks from the
folks who are quite inaccurately referred to as "pro-life." Their use of
brainwashing tactics in order to defile the subconscious minds of
innocent children is an ATROCITY (to use a favorite bible-thumper word)
which will soon be widely known for what it really is: pedophilic
death-cult abuse.
Feebleminded homophobic threats of future attacks committed by
the christianic neo-nazis make clear that such people have no idea who
they are threatening. When you folks decide to carry out your little war
on rationality, be apprised that many unpleasant surprises await. I'll
let you in on a little secret here, Sparky: the pinkos and heathens and
fag-sympathizers are your intellectual superiors. Abortion-clinic pipe-
bombings and attacks like those of that famous dead idiot John Salvi
are farts in a hurricane.
In closing, here's a nice quote from a famous christian:
"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior
as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness,
-------snippola-------
against those by whom today this poor people are plundered and
exploited."
Adolph Hitler, in a speech delivered April 12, 1922
Published in "My New Order"
Quoted in "Freethought Today" April 1990
Y'all have a nice day, now!
Sincerely,
Your Worst Nightmare.
(someone who can think) :)
From: Neal Horsley
I want thank you for so forthrightly revealing your point of view. I will
make sure your words are heard by my Sunday School class at Kansas Baptist
Church and of course by the people who reqularly visit the Hard Shell
Christian Gallery. Extinction, like death itself, is a difficult fate to
contemplate. But extinction is more frightening for materialists who find
their personal immortality in visions of their union with the "Whole."
I
must point out one clear fallacy in your analysis. You said, " The
forthcoming extinction of supernatural cults has been insured by natural
processes whose existence has been CONFIRMED by rigorous, skeptical,
peer-reviewed science." In order for your statement to be true, the
existence of the Being who contains within Himself the entire universe would
have to be dismissed as a theoretical possiblity by science. In order for
science to have accomplished such a dismissal, an expetition would have
to
have been mounted that scoured the ends of the universe and returned with
pictorial evidence proving the absence of the Creator. Such an expedition
has not been mounted. Nor, is one planned in your lifetime. Therefore
your
"CONFIRMED" by science idea is false. And you are misled by predicating
your analysis on that syllogism. A syllogism that begins with a false
premise is false no matter low logially accurate the other factors in the
syllogism. But of course you know all this don't you. Fact is, you are
not
interested about the truth, which is why you fabricate or pass on the
fabricated quote from "Hitler." How quickly you squander your credibility.
That's always been Satan's weakness. He simply cannot avoid lying. He
is,
after all, the father of lies. Liar, liar, pants (as well as all other
parts of your being soon to be) on fire. Unless you repent.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Should I try to talk him into getting set up as a point?
edweird
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Literally Seaking
|Date: 08 Mar 97 18:35:36
EID:c0f2 22689460
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321b178
-> On 06 Mar 97 05:24:35, Jim Staal got back to Dan Ceppa
JS> Sorry. I am no scientist.
DC> That's quite obvious.
JS> And I thank God for that. Therefore, I _can_ have faith. My
JS> 'self-made' ego doesn't have to get in the way.
Wrong, Jimbo. It's your self-inflicted ignorance that
stands in your way.
... Creationism in schools? Sure. Right after Thermodynamics in church.
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: All
|Sub: God's terrorists!
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:28:48
EID:6985 2268a380
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321cc00
-> On 06 Mar 97 15:23:19, Bryson Hughes got back to Jason Harmon
JH> You were put on trial by angels?
BH> Yes Jason I was. It was the most horrifying experience of my life.
Isn't it just great that god sends his angels out to terrorize
people?
... "Help! I've been abducted by god's gestapo angels!" Bryson Hughes
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: A toast to dracula
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:50:21
EID:b51f 2268a640
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d10d
-> On 03 Mar 97 18:54:56, Rod Swift got back to Dan Ceppa
RS> * On 25-02-97 at 22:24, DAN CEPPA wrote to KEN YOUNG,
DC> "Sin" is a construct of your dogma. If you feel you are
DC> sinful, that's your problem, not Rod's.
RS> Amen, God Dan. I note I don't sin under your godly dominions and
RS> protection :)
It's a pity that the xians cannot see beyound the dogma that
they have in order to reconcile the one truth that their
"godling" gave them: The Golden Rule
However, as another poster noted, they even fucked that up
with their twisted wording of a truth that was old before
their religion got ahold of it.
... +Origin: ALTERCATION, NETWORK! Beating people up for Jesus!
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: Accepting Reality
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:55:42
EID:2e59 2268a6e0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d24e
-> On 06 Mar 97 08:15:02, Ken Wiens got back to Jason Harmon
Gee, Kenny, you drop back in here after a long absence
and don't even take the time to say 'hi' to me.
KW> the Book of Mormon or the Koran are factual. Well, perhaps
KW> most of us. What can I say, I'm a FUNDY!!"
No, Kenny, you are a fucking fundy asshole, and I mean that
sincerely.
How many 12 year old rape victims did you execute during
your sabbatical?
... They were HOMOS! God was justified to kill them. per Ken Weins
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Alternative Or Straw
|Date: 08 Mar 97 20:59:42
EID:8071 2268a760
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d33e
-> On 06 Mar 97 00:07:00, Richard Smith got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> He has to. Everyone laughed at that and he's trying to
DC> rebuild what's left of it.
RS>
RS> It's ugly to see a man trying to compensate for a small
RS> penis.
Hmmmm, are you talking about Ragland or Staal?
... "Die and fry!" 1:1-24:18 All 432 lines of Gospel according to Staal
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Bryson Hughes
|Sub: asaity
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:03:50
EID:2c5e 2268a860
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d436
-> On 06 Mar 97 15:05:35, Bryson Hughes got back to Dan Ceppa
BH> Nobody said anything about what the intelligence is going to do.
DC> You, OTOH, prey on those that don't have a modicum of intelligence.
DC> Makes it easier for you to pawn off you non-evidence as "evidence".
BH>
BH> Ad hominem seems to be a specialty around here.
What ad hominem? You have provided any evidence. You consistantly
avoid doing so.
BH> That is exactly what I'm going to do: Choose the time and place,
BH> choose the evidence, choose WHO I'm going to present it to. But as
Try it in the Barney Echo. However, I doubt even they would
believe it.
BH> get. But I probably won't be on that topic too much if I don't choose
BH> to be. I'll choose other topics.
You have too. After all, you don't have any evidence to back up
your claims on the current topic.
... Fundies are like farts. They all smoke, and leave a bad smell.
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: Ceppa - Holographic
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:09:12
EID:ce8d 2268a920
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d578
-> On 05 Mar 97 04:55:09, John Brawley got back to David Worrell
DW> DC>>> IOW, it in now an accurate comparison to your theory.
DW> JB>> The English major uses "your" instead of "you're,"
============================
DW> Subj : Ceppa - Holographic
DW> ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
DW> On 23 Feb 97, Dan Ceppa wrote:
DC> Your right. I should have said the the Moon is made out of
JB> .....****
JB> See this?
Yes, John, now he does. However, the first lines quoted above
are _all_ that you quoted when you took exception to my typo.
Whether you like it or not, your flack over my typo was because
you fucked up your original quote and forgot to include it.
... Eeny Meeny, Jelly Beanie, spirits are about to speak.
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Educational Experienc
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:12:32
EID:53fd 2268a980
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d640
-> On 03 Mar 97 10:36:04, Rod Swift got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> RS> thread. Mr Erudite never got it :) :) :) He in fact started
DC> RS> using it and spelling it the SAME WAY! *bwahahaha* :)
DC> So, what else is new? After all, he's the "English Major,
DC> 3,000 times or more demoted. :)
RS> But he's so error-dyte :) :)
Common, Rod! You missed a perfect pun: That should have
been "error-dyke".
... Jesus' last words: "Oh, SHIT, that fuckin' HURTS!" Hector Plasmic
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:21:03
EID:5fc8 2268aaa0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321d83f
-> On 06 Mar 97 05:06:17, Jim Staal got back to Lynda Bustilloz
LB> Scriptural evidence in the Genesis account that immortality was the
LB> original plan, please?
JS> Well, the fact that death wasn't mentioned prior to the gig is one
JS> indication. The other is the 'tree of life':
Your really do enjoy debunking yourself in a single post,
don't you, Jimbo:
JS> (Gen 3:22 NIV) And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like
JS> one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out
JS> his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live
JS> forever."
What happens if you can't live forever, Jimbo? Think hard
and try exercising that single remaining neuron of yours.
While you are at it, explain the "like us" in the above
bible babbling.
JS> (Gen 3:24 NIV) After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side
JS> of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and
JS> forth to guard the way to the tree of life.
Now, explain where the east side of the garden is so that we can
all watch the sword flash. It would make a great tourist
attraction.
... "We win when you learn to think.": Kelsey Bjarnason
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 08 Mar 97 22:21:54
EID:6326 2268b2a0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321e682
-> On 06 Mar 97 05:18:59, Jim Staal got back to Fredric Rice
JS> KKK is no Christian organization. Do not confuse False Christian Scum
JS> [tm] with Christianity.
Just as we don't confuse you with what you are: True Xian Scum.
... God's baud rate is 0.
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Karen Davis
|Sub: Moin Hallo Hi
|Date: 08 Mar 97 22:39:24
EID:bf23 2268b4e0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321ea9c
-> On 05 Mar 97 16:02:21, Karen Davis got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> contacted the State Education Department. Perhaps more
DC> on that after Monday, as I'll be speaking to their legal
DC> department. I got a bit of feedback from them on my
KD> Good choices.
It's getting better. I got a reply today from the
school councilor. Se has determined that "every day
to day activities" take precident over the part of the
decree that notes "MAJOR DECISIONS". It took over
10 days to get the reply back to me.
Her carbons where to the Principal, Superintendant and my
ex. Mine will be to the first 2 plus the State School
Commissioner and the Legal Department.
KD> Interestingly, as I mentioned on IRC yesterday, I stop being a teacher
KD> in 33 days.
Damn!
KD> I received a private sector job offer with an internet
KD> provider that I couldn't turn down.
I can understand that. I had my 9th grade math teacher take
the same route. What I can't understand is why those that
can teach can't make a decent living by doing what they can
do best. (Sorry, it's not my intention to give you a guilt
trip. It's just my view of this society.)
DC> BTW, how many days a year do kids go to school in your area?
KD> 180 or so here in CA. I'm not sure how that compares with elsewhere
in
KD> the US - I assume it's typical.
As it is, it's that very same figure. I messed with those days
and deterimined that school lasts for only eight months, with
all in that time frame weekends free. I don't remember that
much time off when I was in grade school. The summer vacation
started about the middle of June and ended just after the 1st
weekend in August. And, the only long break was between xmass and
New Years.
... I'm not bitter, I'm just pissed off at the lack of education.
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Warring Christan Faction
|Date: 08 Mar 97 22:42:48
EID:eb6a 2268b540
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3321eb68
-> On 06 Mar 97 00:02:56, Richard Smith got back to Dan Ceppa
KW> So Bear's still ahead of Leo.
DR> Ursa Major or Ursa Minor?
DC> Andress.
RS> . . . undressed . . .
DC> She is far ahead of us, that's for sure! Something
DC> like making it a photo-tittle!
RS> Sorry I disrupted the pun thread. I was merely drooling a
RS> the thought . . .
I'd respond to that but you've got me thimkib of ot...
... Glodberg virsus detected. Hit head on keyboard (T/M?) or bAort?
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Websites Etc.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:14:13
EID:1ec3 226901c0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 332200d5
-> On 03 Mar 97 10:42:12, Rod Swift got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> RS> It's just with all that deity sex being gay, we thought you might
want
DC> RS> to reconsider being a deity, just for a bit :)
DC> I'm the God of a Different Color!
RS> Oh, invisibly pink? :)
Naww, that's my friend, Daisy, the Invisible Hippo.
DC> gave me a laugh! Then again, at least one of those Godessses
DC> is there when I need to talk, dance, or shoot darts.
RS> Is Freyr, the layer or slayer, among them?
Well, Pat brings her husband around every so often and his
name is Fred.
DC> 2: You became fundy and should have died.
RS> I never stopped questioning, I just removed that question due to
RS> the fact that the answer was self-evident :) :)
Talked to my Mom just a moment ago. Seems like I inherited
my questioning from my Dad.
And, yes, I'm very proud of it. After all, that's the
best thing that he ever taught me. (Though hitting a
baseball does come in second place, just behind the
tagline, of course!)
... The best baker and teacher I've known: Dad!
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Darryl Gonzalez
|Sub: 10 foot high and rising!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:18:23
EID:8625 22690240
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 332201cf
-> On 04 Mar 97 21:51:00, Darryl Gonzalez got back to DAVID RICE
DG> admit to the occurrance of a global ice age, but you deny that a global
DG> flood could possibly have occurred. Tell me, David, what does ice turn
DG> to when it's heated? Is it not WATER?
Tell me, Darryl, Darryl and your other brother Darryl:
How much ice gets assimilated into the frozen ground and
returns directly to the water table?
... Bad news, Darryl. I sold your soul to the devil.
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Darryl Gonzalez
|Sub: J.J. NEEDS TO BE
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:21:04
EID:5f61 226902a0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220270
-> On 04 Mar 97 21:27:00, Darryl Gonzalez got back to Richard Smith
RS> the Bible? Oh, I forgot, you're ignoring those postings of
RS> scripture that I already made to this effect, aren't you?
DG> This is so laughable, it hardly deserves a response! Who are you to
DG> judge God, Richard?
Got evidnce of a god? We have a prosecutor and a defense
attorney at hand to take the son of a bitch to trial.
... "Christianity is not established by law." U.S. SUPREME COURT, 1860
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|From: Marilyn Burge
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Damned fundies don't know their own theology
|Date: 09 Mar 97 20:07:49
EID:131c 2269a0e0
MSGID: 1:105/302.666 1f6c9e8d
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 33218162
On (08 Mar 97) Ken Young babbled to Marilyn Burge...
MB> Saw a sign outside a pentecostal church yesterday that said
MB> God without Man
MB> is still God
MB> Man without God
MB> is Nothing!
MB> According to their own theology, that's a lie; if we are
MB> "nothing," why did their gawd love us so much he allowed
MB> his son to be sacrificed for our sakes?
KY> He loves us, but He does not need us. What for? So yes, He still
KY> would be God without us.
MB> I think I'll sit down an explain the Bible to some mis-
MB> begotten fundy preacher. He apparently needs a lesson.
KY> Have fun. Perhaps you'll learn something. :)
Fat chance. His marquee is wrong. Live with it.
I've yet to see the braindead fundy who can teach me how to
walk and chew gum at the same time, let alone teach me anything
of actual value.
MB> Damned fundies, anyway. Can't they get ANYTHING right?
KY> Damned? I thought it was you heathens that were damned? :)
you arrogant little cocksucker! You're the one who is damned --
damned to spend your life in self-imposed ignorance. Live with it.
... Christianity: A house of cards lacking a first floor.
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Sally Springett
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Damned Shoes
|Date: 08 Mar 97 07:27:00
EID:92d6 22683b60
MSGID: 1:2613/313@ 1bab508e
DM> On the whole, this is another sad instance of what happens
DM> when people who don't speak English very well (like Koreans or
DM> fundies) attempt to come up with a brand name.
RS> LOL . . . yep, I was hoping for some extreme form of profanity
RS> or something, but this'll do.
I heard a representative of the company say that the namers had
been gone from the company for a year before the meaning of the
name was discovered. I suspect it wasn't ignorance and there is a
lot of not-so-smothered laughter emanating from somewhere as we
speak.
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
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|From: Sally Springett
|To: Don Martin
|Sub: Al Debunks Applesauc
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:54:00
EID:9806 226976c0
MSGID: 1:2613/313@ 9e5ae195
DM> OK, gang, let's hear the last name for Lady Mary ____
DM> ________, the 18th century Brit who introduced smallpox
DM> vaccination in her country, and who, when a younger woman at
DM> the theatre observed that her hands were dirty, had the
DM> delicious gall to reply, "That is nothing, my Dear, you ought
DM> to see my _feet_!"
Lady Mary Wortley Montague, of course. I went to Margaret Drabble
to check the spelling and learned there was a life in 1956 and
letters in the 60s. It's not THAT shaggy.
I'm no parvenu old fart; I'm the real thing.
___ Blue Wave/386 v2.30
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: SUE ALEXANDER
|Sub: jesus needed...
|Date: 07 Mar 97 17:41:00
EID:226e 22678d20
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Sue Alexander to Jim Staal <=-
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Sue Alexander <=-
>>>RS> Never had a chick nor boinked one.
Me neither. Jesus must have been ugly as shit.
>>JS> He was never married. Why would one who never sinned
>>JS> have sex outside of marriage?
I wonder what "sex outside of marriage" has to do with
"sin." It seems like a very freaky belief.
>SA> Why was he never married, Jim? It was expected by
>SA> culture that everyone should be married by a certain
>SA> age, which he had long since passed.
The Bible implies that Jesus WAS married.
>JS> I could provide the scripture for you, Sue, but this
>JS> computer doesn't have my online bible[sic] on it, but,
>JS> it wasn't necessary that He[sic] have offspring...
What the fuck does "offspring" have to do with marriage?!
SA> OK... so Jesus did not need to "boink" a female. He
SA> did need to live within the culture at that time, as
SA> the bible states he was 30 years old when he started
SA> to actively preach. The culture (from what I understand)
SA> expected men to marry. Why did he not then marry, but
SA> not have "relations" with his wife?
Maybe Jesus was "confused" (i.e. homosexual). That still
would not prevent him from getting married. John 2 seems
to imply that the wedding taking place was Jesus'.
... "I believe in Jeshua bar Casper-the-Holy-Spook!" David Rice
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
--- Silver Xpress Mail System 5.4H1
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: DAVID RAGLAND
|Sub: ALTERNATIVE OR STRAW
|Date: 07 Mar 97 17:49:00
EID:1b00 22678e20
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting David Ragland to Martin Goldberg <=-
Hi stupid shit.
>MG> OK... name this sceintific evidence. Where in the
>MG> field of molecular biology is there any evidence for
>MG> a creator.
DR> The evidence[sic] is right in front of you everytime
DR> you look through a microscope. Look at a cell. I mean
DR> look at it real close, Martin. And tell me that you
DR> really believe that it is an accident.
No one believes that a cell formed by "accident." If you
had any brain cells, you'd know this fact.
... A man with a gun is less dangerous than a man with a Bible and a gun.
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: CHARLES CREAGER
|Sub: Theft & Catholicism
|Date: 10 Mar 97 08:27:00
EID:c2c1 226a4360
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
Your god is an asshole.
Thank you for your attention in this matter.
... "Oh shit!" -----(Jesus upon opening his fortune cookie @ last supper)
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: TOM HUBER
|Sub: Mormongate
|Date: 10 Mar 97 08:38:00
EID:c093 226a44c0
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Tom Huber to Steve Quarrella
TH> I'm puzzled
To put it mildly....
TH> as to why your wishes haven't been honored (I know you
TH> don't know why), because the husband *is* the head of
TH> the house [...]
Only because the man is physically stronger and therefore
is able to dominate the rest of the household with threats,
violence, economic extortion, and rape. I.e. a typical
Christian family.
If Christian men were not prone to violence against women,
the family would be an equal partnership among peers (as
it should be).
... ([Sault of Tarsus] + [Epileptic Seizure]) = Christianity
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: DAN CEPPA
|Sub: Deluded Idiots!
|Date: 10 Mar 97 08:43:00
EID:d648 226a4560
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Dan Ceppa to Bryson Hughes <=-
-> Bryson Hughes got back to Karl Schneider
>BH> Considering that what I experience was quite
>BH> terrifying early on, I would not wish it upon you.
>BH> It is a good gift and worth cherishing, but it
>BH> came with a terror. I remember the dread I felt
>BH> when I realized God[sic] is real after all. Then
>BH> when I was put on trial by angels, I just knew
>BH> I was cooked, if you know what I mean. But I
>BH> emerged a better man for it.
I remember the dread I felt when I realized that Santa
Claus is real after all. Then I knew I would be getting a
lump of coal in my stocking, and no presents under the
tree, because I had been naughy (not nice) all year! Oh,
the terror I felt! The terror! Mercifully, you have me
to warn you, so you need not face that terror yourself:
I would not wish this terror on anyone.
DC> If you thought that Jimb-ozo was nuts, this guy is
DC> certifiable!
It is rather like a half-dozen other folks. It still
does not rate as low as the agonized screams heard when
drilling too deeply underground. Or JFK taking over the
planet with Kissinger and Satan.
... ([Sault of Tarsus] + [Epileptic Seizure]) = Christianity
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
--- Silver Xpress Mail System 5.4H1
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: DAN CEPPA
|Sub: The Flock
|Date: 10 Mar 97 08:47:00
EID:1ea3 226a45e0
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Dan Ceppa to Martin Goldberg <=-
-> Martin Goldberg got back to Ken Young
>>KY> And no, currently I am church hunting..[sic]
>MG> What's the legal limit?
No fewer than five a year. Any fewer and Satan will
dock your pay.
DC> (looking into my crewel) Is there a size limit as well?
Yes. The cumulative I.Q. of the congregation must be
below 90. Unfortunatley, these are easy to find.
... "State lotteries are an official tax on stupidity." -- Robert Curry
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: JIM STAAL
|Sub: Oops, Caught Again
|Date: 10 Mar 97 09:06:00
EID:3256 226a48c0
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Fredric Rice
JS> I have only one master: Jesus Christ, and He[sic] asks
JS> only that I love Him[sic] and keep His[sic] commandments.
Ah, you're into bedroom discipline. Poor Wilbur.
... Yeah... maybe 5 years from now, when she's 18. -- QF
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: DAVE HAMILTON
|Sub: Cheese Whiz
|Date: 10 Mar 97 09:08:00
EID:a8ac 226a4900
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting Dave Hamilton to Jim Staal <=-
>JS> I think the recent revelations by Ron Fitzsimmons,
>JS> head of the Coalition of Abortion Practitioners
>JS> (his previous lie) makes any further arguement
>JS> moot. 3000-4000 a year, healthy fetuses, healthy
>JS> mothers.
DH> Where can I verify this?
Only in Jim's fevered imagination.
In a few hours I will be looking into the claim myself.
I'll post any results I find.
... "Sounds like a job for Cap't. Thorazine!" -- Marty Leipzig
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
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|From: DAVID RICE
|To: DAVID WORRELL
|Sub: In the news
|Date: 10 Mar 97 09:17:00
EID:93b1 226a4a20
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10280
-=> Quoting David Worrell to Rod Swift <=-
> Rod Swift wrote to David Worrell:
>>DW> Fuck a trial. Just take 'em out in an open field,
>>DW> strap one of their bombs to them, and set the fucker
>>DW> off. My tax dollars can be put to better use -
>>DW> there's no need for a trial for terrorists. Only
>>DW> humans have the right to a trial by their peers.
The above sounds very George Bush-ish.
>RS> Please, can the partners of all the lesbians injured
>RS> in the Atlanta bombing press the button to detonate
>RS> it?
DW> Only if they can manage to take the detonator away
DW> from me.
Are you serious?
... Jesus can't perform tricks in front of skeptics (Matt 13:58 Mk 6:5-6)
* Shy.David@EdenBBS.com
--- Silver Xpress Mail System 5.4H1
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Cracker Barrel boycott
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:09:38
EID:1948 22690120
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224612
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313e430
KY> Gays will go to Hell if they are not saved, and if you are
KY> gay, you cannot be saved.
RS> You claim that gays cannot be saved. Why do you attempt to? Are
RS> you admitting they have no free will because they cannot be saved?
RS> Is this a revision of your policy that they can change? Are you
RS> now admitting you were wrong, and they *cannot change* and *be
RS> saved*?
A gay can get saved, but if they get saved they cannot remain gay. They
will be changed by the power of God.
KY> Now, the difference is simply the difference
KY> between the person and one's
KY> actions. Just because I am against what a person does,
KY> does not mean I am against that person.
RS> But you said gays are unable to be saved. You also said you were
RS> talking about the sin, not the sinner. It's clear you are lying.
Gays are unable to be saved, simply because once saved they are no longer
homosexuals.
RS> Rod "...you should leave, now, while you still have a chance" Swift
:)
Nah.. How would you learn anything, then? :)
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: The Jesus was homosexual
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:17:46
EID:9b54 22690220
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 332247fa
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312f306
FR> rs> that he wants his queer love to live for a long time :)
FR> What's funny is that Christanics were unable to remove the
FR> exhibitions of homosexuality from their mythologies.
RS> Ken did so in one post to me just earlier. Claimed I was
RS> obsessive because i had the gall to defend my sexuality.
No, not because you were defending your sexuality. There have been times
when you mentioned it when homosexuality was not even the topic at hand.
And sure, that is fine, but there are those gays that make it the only thing
they seem to care about.
RS> Praise Jesus, and pass the condemnation.
RS> The fact is that religion is always used by anyone to gain power
RS> and this power leads to corruption, and this corruption to tyranny.
RS> And it is our job to be vigilant and to stop the abuses of our
RS> fellow humans by a small group of humans who'd rather use
RS> religion in a way more akin to Orwell's "Animal Farm"
RS> (politically) or 1984 (social order) than for benevolence.
Well, not all CHristians would do this. I sadly admit, some would like
to, as they go way too far with morality, but I doubt if the bulk of Christians
would be for tyranny just to try to stifle immorality.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Cracker Barrel boycott
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:25:24
EID:1948 22690320
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 332249c4
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312f87a
RS> I cannot believe he has YET to justify his assumptions that:
RS> 1) only one sexual orientation is the correct one
Because only one is natural and has a practical purpose.
RS> 2) that it is his sexual orientation if it is
Heterosexuality is that sexual preference that has a practical purpose to
it and is natural.
RS> 3) that everyone is "born straight"
If anyone is born with any sexual preference or orientation, heterosexuality
is it.
RS> 4) that gay people "choose".
There have been studies to suggest this.
And homosexuality is obviously a part of you, right? It is part of who
you are and what makes you, you. Well then, just as through other experiences
and choices, you decided what your personality would eventually grow into,
you also decided to be gay, the same way.
RS> He's not answered any one of the four with any scientific
RS> evidence, despite having scientific evidence TO THE CONTRARY
RS> being provided.
RS> He still spews the same shit, as if he were Laurie Appleton on
RS> Creationism/Evolutionism.
Funny, he always seems to make sense. Perhaps, you just aren't deep enough
to understand.
RS> You debunk him, and he just blinks and ignores the fact that he's
RS> been debunked. He just restates the allegation ignorantly.
RS> Rod "...maybe it's time to give him a reason to leave" Swift :)
Go ahead, try it.. It will just make me stay all the more.. I got bored
on other echos and nets, as there wasn't any more challenge.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:32:34
EID:f287 22690400
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224b72
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312fc08
KY> See, while some are conscience doing it, gays may subconsciously make
KY> the choice to be homosexual.
RS> The evidence is clear, however. If it were a subconsciously
RS> decided, it could be eliminated by therapy.
And who says it couldn't be. Now, I do not generally trust most therapy,
but there have been those to switch back to their normal selves.
RS> You are still debunked. Science has debunked you. Did you read
RS> that pamphlet I sent you? I can send you another copy if you
RS> like.
No thanks.. I read it, but I see enough propaganda these days..
RS> Rod "... and finally, seek help for your desire to attack gay
RS> people because you consider them easy targets. The fact that
RS> we care about your mental health is exhibited because we don't
RS> want to see you start to hate yourself for arguing lies and hence
RS> discovering your self deception, Ken.... Get help now, please!" Swift
:)
Attack? Certainly no more than you attack Christians for their religious
beliefs.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Cracker Barrel boycott
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:35:38
EID:1948 22690460
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224c2a
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312fcbe
KY> DR> JOH 21:7 JOH 21:20
KY> So, saying that you love someone, has to be sexual?
RS> Homosexuality has nothing to do with sex. Homosexuality has
RS> everything to do with sexual orientation.
Oh, but it does- one's sexual feelings for one sex or the other.
Not necessarily the act, but what one person is sexually attracted to.
RS> We never claimed that. We claimed that Jesus was a homosexual --
RS> he was. It's clear. He loved a man. He's a man. It's love,
RS> it's homosexual. It's homosexual love.
It's love. But not homosexual love. If you love your family, is it the
same type of love as when you love your mate?
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Re: "True" Christian Dod
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:39:14
EID:6542 226904e0
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224d02
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312fcfc
KY> I will admit, when I first saw him, and he promoted that
KY> book, I did start seeing it that way. But now, I tend to
KY> believe a spiritual death was what was meant.
RS> Why did your belief change? The bible is the inerrant word of
RS> God. God commands you to kill faggots for him. Further, you are
RS> to stone them. Their death is on their heads.
My beliefs changed because I realized that if a non-Christian is killed,
he no longer has a chance to become saved.
But like I said, even if that was what was meant, that is no longer, as
we now have the grace of Christ.
Does it actually say one is supposed to physically kill gays? Not last
I checked..
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:43:56
EID:f287 22690560
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224e1c
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3312ffd8
MB> KY> I think you just hit upon it. "Consciously" seems to be the
MB> KY> key. See, while some are conscience doing it, gays may
MB> KY> subconsciously make the choice to be homosexual. We make
MB> KY> choices all the time without realizing it. And throughout
MB> KY> your life, what happens to you, will also be a big factor in
MB> KY> the what choices you make.
MB> Gee. How does that explain the measurable differences in a gay
MB> man's corpus collosum?
RS> Shh. Don't confuse him with all that scientific "mumbo-jumbo"...
RS> he's trying to be, errr, ummm, theoretical :)
Well, get yourself ready to make some new taglines with this one.. Yes,
there may be physical differences between gays and heterosexuals. But it
is possible for people with their own mind power to change themselves physically.
This may sound bizarre, but it is definitely true that someone can physically
make themselves ill or well, by either willing it, or by a great deal of
stress. Therefore, it is possible for some to actually physically change
themselves when they start having unnatural feelings.
And if there is a difference, are you saying that there is something wrong
with gays?
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:48:10
EID:3d75 22690600
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33224f1a
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 331302ac
KY> Funnym I don't seem to recall being for some of that stuff.
KY> Yes, when gays kept it quiet, it was much better.
RS> Would you prefer us to shut up and wait an indeterminable time at
RS> the table of human rights for some piecemeal human rights scraps?
I do not mean if the topic comes up that yopu should remain silent, but
there is a healthy medium, and it is possible to go too far with being public
with your sexual orientation.
KY> They were still around, but who needs to advertise their sexual
KY> orientation?
RS> It would be nice if you were a bit more objective. "Advertise"?
Well, honestly, for good reason, you are not exactly "objective" either.
RS> You cruel and sick bastard for even suggesting that we should not
RS> be open, and honest, and affirming of our sexual orientation.
Not saying to never let it be known, just that one should set limits.
RS> I bet you'd be insulted if we told you to NEVER ever *flaunt*
RS> your religion EVER again. That's EXACTLY what you tell us to do.
I wasn't aware that religion and sexual orientation were the same thing.
RS> You are sick, Ken, you need help. Heed the words. The APA
RS> thinks *you're* the mentally unstable one who needs help to come
RS> to terms with HUMAN DIFFERENCE, Ken.
That's okay.. Just another group to be wrong.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:28:08
EID:3d75 22691b80
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227498
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313e4e8
MO> KY> Sorry to see that you consider them as
RS> inferiors. Perhaps you should
MO> KY> work on being more tolerant of others. :)
RS> I'm sorry you see gays as inferior, Ken. Perhaps you should work
RS> on being more tolerant towards others.
RS> Besides being more tolerant, being more understanding and
RS> KNOWLEDGEABLE of the people you see as inferior is mandatory in
RS> finding a solution for your illogical hatred.
Did I ever say that gays were inferior? No, they are just wrong as far
as morals and sexual orientation goes.
And do I really hate gay people? If I did, I think I'd be a bit more violent
to gays..
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: You won't believe this q
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:31:32
EID:a058 22691be0
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227564
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313e5dc
RS> But haven't you recanted that "theory" and now claim it's a
RS> subconscious choice (i.e. yet ANOTHER "theory" that has been
RS> debunked before, and I have now debunked thoroughly)?
No. Why is a subconscious choice any less of a choice than a conscious
one? You are still the one deciding things.
KY> Just one tiny bit of my brilliance that everyone should realize.
RS> The thing that everyone should realise is that you are a hateful
RS> idiot.
Wrong on both counts. Perhaps you are the idiot though, if you think I
am either an idiot or hateful. I love everyone, as a human being, even
if you cannot see that.
KY> Just because someone will have an unfortunate eternity,
KY> does not mean you love them any less.
RS> Oh, excuse me. I thought the bible says that you had no right to
RS> make such judgements. Then again, when you're a salad-bar
RS> Christian who can't even read and understand the bible, or that
RS> you flip-flop over Leviticus, what makes me want to believe you
RS> are a "true Christian" at all?
What judgement can't I make? That people will go to Hell. The Bible is
pretty plain about that, that non-believers will go to Hell. And if one
truly believes and accepts, then they aren't gay.
What makes me a Christian is that I believe the BASICS of the Bible.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:36:24
EID:3d75 22691c80
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227688
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313e694
KY> DW> Have you ever kissed your girlfriend/wife in public?
KY> DW> Have you ever held hands with her? Why did you feel the
KY> DW> need to advertise your sexual orientation like that?
KY> That IMO would not be promoting sexual orientation.
RS> ...except when homosexual people do it, right?
Nope.. Stop trying to find something to argue about when there's nothing.
That, even if I may not like it, would not be advertising one's sexual orientation
as I see it.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: You forgot to answer thi
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:38:18
EID:7c49 22691cc0
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 332276fa
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313e6d2
RS> fundy come and go during
KY> MB> my time here. I've even seen fundies 'converted' to agnosticism.
KY> MB> I've only seen one person 'converted' the other direction, and
he
KY> MB> went from secular Jew to practicing Jew -- hardly a direction you
KY> MB> would recommend, I'm sure.
KY> Nope.. Now, if they switched to Messianic Jew, on the
KY> other hand, that would be another story..
KY> And anyway, I am here now.. HolySmoke will never be the same. :)
RS> You'll leave soon enough :) You'll also whine on the way out
RS> claiming you weren't treated fairly, when in fact it is because
RS> you were writing out "reality cheques" that bounced when they
RS> entered reality and were examined by all and sundry :)
No, I have been here long enough to not expect to be treated fairly. Most
here seem to be fairly bigoted against Christianity, and I realize that,
and am still here.
But, you never know.. Enough time, and if I get another or two like me
on here, and I may have people like you running out afraid of a challenge.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:40:26
EID:f287 22691d00
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 3322777a
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313f258
KY> FR> Everyone is born not believing in deity constructs,
KY> FR> Ken. Occultism and superstitious fear and hatred must
KY> FR> be ingrained in an individual before they start
KY> FR> believing in deity constructs.
KY> How do you know a baby doesn't have any belief in a god?
RS> Why do you claim that they do?
I didn't. I simply asked how do you know they don't? I brought it up
merely as a possibility.
RS> Most notably me. I only believe that the ones with a patriachal
RS> deity construct of love *and* hate could only be believed in by
RS> someone who wishes to claim that they love everyone, but in fact
RS> wish to only judge other humans.
Well, I cannot speak for all, but I for one do not judge by myself. But
if one goes against the fruits of the spirit, I have every right to judge.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Re: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:44:52
EID:3d75 22691d80
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227884
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313f478
KY> No to the first one, yes to the other two.. Just because
KY> some Christians killed people that supposedly were witches
KY> (most weren't, as it was all political), does not mean the
KY> whole Christian church would be for it.
RS> So it's ok to falsely accuse people of witchcraft and then to
RS> kill them? How wonderfully loving and Christian of you.
Again with putting words in my mouth, I see. I NEVER said that
it was right for anyone to do that.
KY> I see nothing wrong with saying that some are "godless
KY> communists." If they are, then they should be exposed.
RS> Exposed for what? Communism is a valid form of political
RS> ideology. Just because you don't believe in it does not mean you
RS> have the right to exterminate people based on political ideology.
I said they need to be exposed, not exterminated.
And exposed for their totalitarian ideas, so they do not become policy.
KY> Kids were a lot more educated back then.
RS> The reason why kids aren't well educated now is because of
RS> defunding of education. Not removal of superstition. In fact,
RS> with the removal of superstition, we could compare current
RS> education with education in the 1920s when creationism was
RS> instructed in the class...
Defunding of education? Are you serious? Not in America.. There is a
lot more funding for education all the time.
RS> ... We've improved a lot by banning religious instruction or
RS> education or ritual on school campuses.
Sure.. Higher illiteracy rates and lower test scores sure show that.
KY> But since we took prayer out of the schools, the students
KY> have been doing a lot worse.
RS> Any proof that proves a causal link between the two? I'd suggest
RS> that the defunding of education on a per-capita student basis is
RS> the real reason.
Well, seeing as it happened at the same time, if religion being kickced
out of American schools didn't make any difference, it was a beaut of a
coincidence.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: USA CompuCensor Law
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:52:26
EID:10b7 22691e80
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227a4a
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313f5aa
KY> FR> Did they use TANKS, dear?
KY> A bit obsessive, aren't we? :) Oh, but that's right..
KY> You have a hard time moving onto something else..
RS> Do you care to give us your spin on Waco?
RS> After all, Christians love to spin-doctor.
RS> Rod "...go on... tell us!" Swift :)
I thought I got into this here, but if not, here goes:
Big surprise what I believe, as I am sure you have an idea, but yes, it
was a govt. plan to make an example out of Koresh to show the people they
can take freedom of religion and the right to bear arms away, and there
is nothing anyone can do about it. Fortunately, Waco more than anything
else, seems to have made many people start to wake up.
Would you like me to continue?
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Quentin Fai
|Sub: Re: ...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 03:56:08
EID:d659 22691f00
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227b28
REPLY: 1:358/1 dec83abb
QF>> It wasn't *that* much of a sacrifice. He's still alive, after all.
KY> Uh, you try being crucified in that way, and see if you like it very
KY> much.
QF> Three hours would be an utterly insignificant amount of
QF> time to an immortal
QF> being.
But Jesus was not in an immortal form. You seem to forget, he came here
as a man.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Murderous Christians
|Date: 09 Mar 97 04:00:40
EID:8f36 22692000
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227c38
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 3319b5b6
DR> the facts you you. You are just too goddamned stupid to
DR> accept the Truth.
ky> I have never denied that some that CLAIM to be Christian,
ky> have committed violent acts, but those acts would go so
ky> much against Christian beliefs that they could not be
ky> Christians.
RS> Yet you yourself have admitted that once a person is a
RS> Xtian, they are a Xtian for life. You refute yourself,
RS> Jelly.
No, I never said that. One may sin and still be a Christian, but if they
keep on with a sinful pattern, they will likely build a wall between them
and God and lose their salvation.
Also, if it was "once saved, always saved," then there could be no such
thing as a Christian turned atheist or Pagan.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Exemplifying examples 1/
|Date: 09 Mar 97 04:03:32
EID:cfa0 22692060
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227ce4
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313cdc6
RS> to force me to join them...
KY> If you are against Christianity, don't go to church.
RS> So I don't go... However, Christians *HAVE* attempted to force me
RS> to join their cult. This means I have a right of equal and
RS> opposite force against them for the preservation of my rights...
Really? Someone actually put a gun to your head, and tried to force you
into their church? How interesting.. If not, just what method did they
use to try to force you into what you so inaccurately call a "cult?"
RS> Christians also have attempted to threaten my civil and political
RS> rights. For this, I am deserved the right to defend myself, and
RS> to take action against them for their injustices. I exact this
RS> justice quite readily and easily, as you know :)
You also seem to assume that all born again Christians try to take away
your rights. Many would actually believe your rights should be kept. After
all, freedom is freedom.
KY> Nope.. Some psychology and so called scientific THEORIES
KY> disagree with me. No scientific fact disagrees with me at all.
RS> Psychology is a science, and hence disagrees with you. The
RS> scientific DATA disagrees with you.
AH, psychology is a science? Well then, are all in the field of psychology
to believed with their findings?
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Ken Young
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Cheese Whiz
|Date: 09 Mar 97 04:09:28
EID:b019 22692120
MSGID: 1:270/420.0 33227e48
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 3313d024
KY> DM> themselves to be carrying out their god's will by so doing.
KY> RS> And the bible even says that Ken has to kill a queer for Christ.
KY> RS> If he doesn't then he's a salad-bar Christian.
KY> Well, I am not sure it means that.
RS> Read Leviticus 20:13. Why should you have all the fun claiming I
RS> should follow the commandment contained in there, and you should
RS> not?
Because there are other places where homosexuality is forbidden.
Besides, I am not saying one shouldn't follow the scripture, just that maybe
people interpreted it wrong.
--- Maximus 3.01
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|From: Quentin Fai
|To: Anthony Grigor-Scott
|Sub: Re: Blavatsky?
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:23:24
EID:057e 22689ae0
PID: SX 4.4P CA-12680
MSGID: 1:358/1 c7a5cece
REPLY: 3:711/933 3320656b
TID: GE/32 1.2
AG> Instead of writing profanities and condemning good people ad truth
AG> you would do well to repent and seek the Lord while you may.
Fuck your petty little god, and the sheep he fucked to produce himself.
... IF God doesn't like how I live, let Him tell me, not YOU!
--- RA2.5/FD2.20/GEcho
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: Baby in Critical Conditio
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:48:07
EID:d509 22695e00
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 e1a448e9
On (04 Mar 97) Lynda Bustilloz wrote to JIM STAAL...
LB> Lynda and Jim were killing time yakking about Baby in Critical
LB> Conditio:
JS> Yeah, the Lovely Wilbur [tm] likes to read over my shoulder from time
JS> to time here, gets angry at what she terms the foolishness of the
JS> whole thing and walks away. :)
LB> Wilbur just wants to make sure you aren't talking to the wimmin!
JS> Yeah, well after 30 years she is a bit possessive, ya know. When you
JS> get a good man you don't want to lose same. :)
LB> She got a good man? Aren't you JEALOUS??
LB> Boy, break ONE little leg, and she takes advantage of the
LB> opportunity.....
LB> ;)
ARGH! LOL!
... Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry. (1 Cor 10:14)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Fundy Frolics 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:48:33
EID:2fe7 22695e00
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 a71a1458
REPLY: 1:123/67.5 331f70f5
On (07 Mar 97) Dan Ceppa wrote to Jim Staal...
-> On 05 Mar 97 09:47:34, Jim Staal got back to ROBERT CURRY
RC> Children do not bear the sins of their parents. Ezekiel, chapter 18.
JS> Doesn't negate Rom 3:23. They do bear the sin of Adam.
DC> That's your founder, Saul speaking.
Yeah, it was my founder speaking through the Holy Spirit to Paul's pen.
... Every one of us shall give account of himself to God. (Rom 14:12)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: jesus needed...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:49:16
EID:52c1 22695e20
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 7e1f591f
REPLY: 1:123/67.5 331f72cc
On (07 Mar 97) Dan Ceppa wrote to Jim Staal...
-> On 04 Mar 97 05:56:25, Jim Staal got back to Rod Swift
RS> "the one he loved". If it is given Jesus loves us all, then a
RS> special mention about this very special relationship with a very
JS> BZZZT! WRONG! Jesus is God. God clearly does _not_ love everyone.
JS> (Rom 9:13 NIV) Just as it is written: "Jacob I loved, but Esau I
JS> hated."
DC> Thank you for pointing out that your omni-benevolent god
DC> isn't, Jimbo.
My God is not 'omni-benevolent'. Where do you get that idea?
... For me to live is Christ, and to die is gain. - Philippians 1:21
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: jesus needed...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:51:05
EID:52c1 22695e60
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 97bae4f3
REPLY: 1:123/67.5 331f738e
On (07 Mar 97) Dan Ceppa wrote to Jim Staal...
-> On 05 Mar 97 06:20:16, Jim Staal got back to Sue Alexander
SA> I understand) expected men to marry. Why did he not then marry, but
SA> not have "relations" with his wife?
JS> Very simple: He didn't marry because, as scripture points out many
JS> many times, the church is His bride. He didn't have offspring in order
DC> That's Saul's dogma that you follow, Jimbo.
This 'saul' you speak of didn't write the Book of Revelations.
DC> You keep forgetting
DC> about the "not change a dot or tittle" that was said by your
DC> godling. Is Saul more powerful than your golding?
This 'saul' you keep referring to didn't change the law.
... But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant. (1 Cor 14:38)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: Oops, Caught Again
|Date: 09 Mar 97 11:56:28
EID:e6e3 22695f00
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 f4d8ec88
REPLY: 1:103/550.0 331f3f64
On (06 Mar 97) Ken Wiens wrote to Jim Staal...
-=> Jim complained of warm pie, cold coffee, and no paper to Marilyn <=
KW> For once I fully agree with one who does not profess to be a
KW> christian over against one who does. I find that very highly
KW> commendable that you worked at the Holiday Inn with a broken
KW> foot. I see no basis for a christian to beg if they are at all
KW> able to work.
Tsk. Ken, Ken, Ken. Do not confuse a tongue-in-cheek, obvious playful
response to someone's off the cuff remark as 'begging'. My several jobs
continue as they did before the accident. The only thing I would not be
able to do is my concert ministry. Other than two jweeks of not being
able to do my job as worship leader, (I was paid for one of them), my
other jobs continue I as am now able to access my computer. The crutch
stuff has made the nerve problem in my arm, but I continue, none the
less.
KW> I was laid off of a job I had for 8 years Nov. 18. The timing
KW> was rather odd. I had just come off of Workman's Comp due to
KW> carpal tunnel release surgery on both my hands during the
KW> summer.
Had the same problem (surgery did nothing to relieve the problem) after
28 years at the same job. (two years ago)
KW> But the company had gone thru two owners during the
KW> time I was out.
My company still had the same owners (my in-laws). After being off for
10 weeks during my recovery, I had been replaced by a guy 20 years my
junior (unskilled) and was told I was no longer welcome there.
KW> I've been looking for work actively since,
KW> sending out my resume to prospective employers, going for
KW> interviews, improving my computer skills.
I sent out over 4,000 mailouts and also established a Multi-Media
business, creating and publishing technical manuals for an
international electrical switch manufacturing firm based in South
Carolina.
KW> Heck, on top of
KW> this I've done odd jobs doing maintenance and upkeep on
KW> people's computers. There are so many people who buy
KW> computers who know next to nothing about them. I've
KW> even thought of becoming self-employed doing this kind
KW> of work.
I do the same thing. :) There are so many totally computer illiterates
out there who have a new Win95 based machine, but have no clue about
it. Or those who wish to upgrade and haven't any idea how or what to
do.
KW> But beg? No way. Not as long as I have any ability
KW> to make money on my own. I find that an undecidedly
KW> unchristian thing to do.
We agree. So...uh...cut me some slack, dude, and don't give a thought to
jumping on Judith's bandwagon getting down on Jim Staal, ok? :)
... Judge not according to appearance. - John 7:24
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: DAVID RICE
|Sub: James Makes Things Up
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:11:51
EID:1efe 22696160
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 5693aefa
On (06 Mar 97) DAVID RICE wrote to JIM STAAL...
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Marilyb Burge <=-
-=> Quoting Marilyn Burge to Jim Staal <=-
DR> >>>MB> But I'm sure this is the exception, rather than the rule.
DR> >>JS> Nope.
>MB> Gimme numbers. I want REAL numbers from the Department of
>MB> Health, not some fundy number made up by somebody who is
>MB> hysterical about even one of the procedures.
JS> No prob: 3000-4000 late term, partial-birth abortions a
JS> year involving healthy mothers and healthy fetuses.
JS> Source: Ron Fitzsimmons, head of the Coalition of Abortion
JS> Practitioners I guess that should do it.
DR> Do you really expect people to take your word for it?! If so,
DR> you're even more ignorant than Appletoon.
Actually, Dave, (other than yourself) I could give a rat'z if they take
my word for it or not, but this is (and has been) easily proven. Check
news archives for Feb 24-26.
... But he that glorieth, let him glory in the lord. (2 Cor 10:17)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Fundy Frolics 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:13:24
EID:7142 226961a0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 c583ad71
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 7682fea4
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
MG> MG>> Babies are totally innocent. Why do any of them need to go
MG> MG>> to hell?
JS> None are innocent. All suffer the effects of original sin. Romans
JS> 3:23.
MG> It's christian attitude just like this that turn people from your
MG> loving and merciful god.
It is not an 'attitude'. It is a scriptural truth.
MG> Now, answer the question. Why do babies need to go to hell?
I havne't a clue. There are Christians (perhaps even a majority) who
don't believe it (or want to believe it. I don't 'want' ot believe it
myself because it seems so unfair) but I believe as did my father and
his father jbefore that, that that is what scripture clearly puts forth,
and I can't/won't argue with scripture.
... For now we live, if ye stand fast in the Lord. (1 The 3:8)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Baby in Critical Conditio
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:17:35
EID:dce5 22696220
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 c6fe15ff
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 76830bf1
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> I do not judge the final 'reward' of anyone. It is not my job.
MG> You're dancing around the point. Let's make the question more
MG> specific. If you believe that someone is going to hell, you have
MG> judged them.
That is exactly correct. That is the basis of my response above. I have
been asked (even with tears) by someone very close to me on this echo to
proclaim jwhether or not I believed this person were condemned. I could
not (one reason was because I sincerely care for this person) because I
believe only God can do that, _and_ because I believe that if God hasj
chosen an individual for redemption, He will bring it about in the end.
'Once saved, always saved'.
MG> I do not tell you this because I think it's wrong. I tell you this
MG> because it is a chritian tenet not to judge.
Correct. However, we are given other exhortations, among which is:
(Gal 6:1 NIV) Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are
spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also
may be tempted.
and...
(1 Tim 5:8 NIV) If anyone does not provide for his relatives, and
especially for his immediate family, he has denied the faith and is
worse than an unbeliever.
and...
(1 Cor 5:13 NIV) God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man
from among you."
And many similar guidelines, plus:
(Mat 16:19 NIV) I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven;
whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you
loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."
So there is an obvious responsibility to believers to use their
intellect in determining certain things.
MG> He is supposed to love the raper of
MG> his daughter.
Yes, I agree. There was however, a picture of a local man (and family)
in our paper in the courtroom as the details of his wife's murder
(mother of 4 small children) killed in a robbery (three times to the
head as she jpleaded for her life) for $70 in a local 7 Eleven store and
I looked at the man's face and cried and told Wilbur if that were me I
probably would have brought a plastic gun into court and killed the SOB
punk that did it. (she knew him) even though I knew it was wrong in
every thing I believe. S**t, Martin! We are still human!
(doesn't mean I actually would have done it, but those were my thoughts
at the time) The man just had this look of total inner pain...
... Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good. (Rom 12:21)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:34:51
EID:9b0c 22696440
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 7b10acf3
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 76830ecf
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> Answer: I don't know what his beliefs are. Certainly his life is
JS> not patterned after the life of Christ.
MG> If they ask him the same question I just asked you, he will assure the
MG> world that he is a true christian, carrying out the will of god.
MG> Who or whatever is a true christian is a matter of great debate.
I agree. Only God really knows.
... Be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath. - James 1:19
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Literally Seaking
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:35:21
EID:9386 22696460
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 1e39719d
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 76831136
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
MG> MG>> If I may quote Hector loosely, "gods dunnit" is not a good
MG> MG>> answer. Let's look for some real answers instead of the ones
MG> MG>> that we wnat to be and have no data for.
JS> Sorry. I am no scientist. I realize that many things claimed are
JS> impossible without Divine intervention.
MG> So if you cannpt expalin it, you just leave it to "divine
MG> intervention"?
What else is there when there is no logical explanation?
MG> You are absolutely correct. You are no scientist.
No arguement here, Martin. :)
... Rejoice in the Lord always: and again I say, Rejoice. (Phi 4:4)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: You lose.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:36:25
EID:2c52 22696480
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 7c62aafd
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 76831b9d
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> Martin, the thing was front page news for several days last week.
JS> The guy is head of the 'abortioner's union', for crying out
JS> loud. I saw/heard his statement on CNN dozens of times. He
JS> stated he had lied in his earlier testimony because he was
JS> afraid that the facts would have swayed the legislation that
JS> was pending at that time.
MG> Will do.
Check news reports for Feb 24-26.
... But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only. - James 1:22
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: Water and Flood.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:37:10
EID:ddea 226964a0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 bbcef847
REPLY: 1:124/4115.221 76832205
On (07 Mar 97) Martin Goldberg wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> sort of scientific point. I merely stated that the Bible
JS> mentions the other as well. Shucks, dude, the whole thing had
JS> to be a miracle. You know, a super-natural occurance. Only
JS> way it could have happened. Everybody knows that in mere
JS> nature, that much water couldn't exist...and by natural law,
JS> where could have it gone afterwards. It was a miracle!
MG> I think that Hecotr's Law has been obeeyd again, although we call this
MG> hector's Vicious circle.
MG> 1. Where is your evidence for a god.
MG> 2. The great flood.
MG> 3. The great flood could not have occured. It would require the
MG> supernatural plus there is no physical evidence.
MG> 4. It was a miracle.
MG> 5. Where is your evidence for miracles.
You get no argument here from me, Martin. I don't expect folks to
believe it if they haven't got faith in God. I may appear silly here in
this echo, but I am no fool. Even the faith has to come from God. Not
everybody can believe. Only those who receive faith. And those who ask
for it can receive it.
... I and my Father are one. - John 10:30
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: You Lose
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:39:08
EID:899d 226964e0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 59ce3a7c
REPLY: 1:105/302.666 0730d639
On (08 Mar 97) Marilyn Burge wrote to Jim Staal...
MB> On (27 Feb 97) Jim Staal babbled to Marilyb Burge...
-=> Quoting Marilyn Burge to Jim Staal <=-
JS> Source: Ron Fitzsimmons, head of the Coalition of Abortion
JS> Practitioners
JS> I guess that should do it.
MB> Now find the Department of Health statistics that corroborate
MB> there are even that many third-trimester abortions in the U.S.,
MB> and maybe we can confirm that Fitzsimmons wasn't sucked into
MB> the fundy camp.
Nah, not my job. Anything that is that big (Fitzsimmon's testimony that
he lied before Congress) is something that I don't have to prove.
... And if children,then heirs;heirs of God,and joint-heirs with Christ.(Rom
8:17)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Baby in Critical Conditio
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:40:10
EID:7779 22696500
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 f1cba636
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 331e59e2
On (06 Mar 97) Ken Young wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> Two things here: a. I do not have 'gods'. Just God[sic].
FR> Are you claiming you left the Christanic death cult now?
JS> I make no such claim. I have never belonged to any death cult. You?
KY> But Jim, you do not agree with him, so obviously you would have to be
KY> part of a "death cult," using reverse fundy logic.
I know nothing of a 'death cult'. It something created by Rice.
... In my Father's house are many mansions. - John 14:2
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: You *didn't* answer this
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:40:53
EID:14a8 22696500
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 67794e6c
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 331e5a84
On (06 Mar 97) Ken Young wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> On (23 Feb 97) Rod Swift wrote to Jim Staal...
RS> Oh, my mistake. It's obvious the Oklahoma City Bombing, uh, err,
RS> Earthquake was caused by people who proclaim fundamental faith
RS> in Jesu..
JS> Evidence???
KY> But he isn't a Christian.. Surely you know by now, non-Christians
KY> don't have to provide evidence for anything THEY say.
After being here 'forever' (see 'participants' list in Holysmoke web
page) I have known that for sometime. :)
KY> And actually, there is reason to believe that at least some within the
KY> govt. had something to do with it.
Really? I wasn't aware of that. Interesting.
... For the son of man is lord even of the sabbath day. (Matt 12:8)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: FUNDY FROLICS 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:42:14
EID:38b5 22696540
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 26550df1
On (07 Mar 97) Roger Hunter wrote to Jim Staal...
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Roger Hunter <=-
RH> Jim, your great grandfather owned slaves.
JS> Uh, no he did not. My great grandfather lived in the Netherlands.
RH> Swoosh! Right over your head, eh?
RH> Take it as a "for example".
It wasn't given as a 'for example'. It was an assumption.
JS> Simple: the NAACP is not God. Bad allegory.
RH> Bullshit. Perfect analogy. Your "original sin" is crap on the
RH> face of it.
Believe what you like. I believe the Bible.
... And if children,then heirs;heirs of God,and joint-heirs with Christ.(Rom
8:17)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: FUNDY FROLICS 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:43:22
EID:38b5 22696560
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 6426724f
On (07 Mar 97) Roger Hunter wrote to Jim Staal...
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Jason Harmon <=-
JH> Here's another question, Jim. Is there anything your god would do
JH> that would make you stop worshiping him?
JS> No. He jwouldn't do anything that would cause me to stop worshipping
JS> Him. He is who He is in the Bible, and He cannot/will not change.
RH> I see. Killing all the Amalakites was fine, they were evil.
RH> Killing every living thing on earth (except for a few breeding
RH> stock) was ok, they were all evil. Eternal torment, far exceeding
RH> any crime, is fine. Burning babies in Hell is fine.
It is His creation, His jplan of Salvation, His will, His world. He can
do what He sees fit in His ominscience.
... Many be called, but few chosen. - Matthew 20:16
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: ROBERT CURRY
|Sub: raising children for hell
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:45:53
EID:075a 226965a0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 57f3a089
REPLY: 1:3603/210 43f7623d
On (07 Mar 97) ROBERT CURRY wrote to JIM STAAL...
RC> RC>> So if the parents give up their superstition, Baby burns in
RC> hell? JS>> What 'superstition'?
RC> Do you mean to imply that the parents can be "saved" even after
RC> giving up the superstitious religious nonsense, Jimbo?
JS> Of course.
RC> So when these "saved" parents give up their Christian superstitions,
RC> they are still nonetheless "saved?"
There are no Christian 'superstitions'.
RC> After all, you claim that their "salvation" cannot be lost.
JS> Correct.
RC> And you believe in a god who delights in the torture of babies.
No delight there.
(2 Pet 3:9 NIV) The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some
understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to
perish, but everyone to come to repentance.
Parents just cannot believe the amount of responsibility they have for
their children.
... For in Him we live, and move, and have our being. - Acts 17:28
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: ROBERT CURRY
|Sub: Fundy Frolics 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:48:50
EID:9be4 22696600
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 9867cf24
REPLY: 1:3603/210 43f7623e
On (07 Mar 97) ROBERT CURRY wrote to JIM STAAL...
MG> Babies are totally innocent. Why do any of them need to go
MG> to hell?
RC> JS>> None are innocent. All suffer the effects of original sin.
RC> JS>> Romans 3:23.
RC> Children do not bear the sins of their parents. Ezekiel, chapter 18.
JS> Doesn't negate Rom 3:23. They do bear the sin of Adam.
RC> Doesn't negate Ezekiel chapter 18. They do not bear the sins of anyone
RC> else: no son bears the sin of his father, nor does any father bear the
RC> sin of his son.
RC> So how do you resolve this bible contradiction, Jimbo? It looks like
RC> you resort (like most Christians) to the Salad Bar Solution.
No contradiction. It is talking about a specific sin (i.e. a man murders
his neighbor. It is _his_ responsibility, not his children's)
... But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only. - James 1:22
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: ROBERT CURRY
|Sub: Literally Seaking
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:49:50
EID:7920 22696620
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 3ba9ec10
REPLY: 1:3603/210 43f7623f
On (07 Mar 97) ROBERT CURRY wrote to JIM STAAL...
RC> with: Martin Goldberg
MG> If I may quote Hector loosely, "gods dunnit" is not a good
MG> answer. Let's look for some real answers instead of the ones
MG> that we wnat to be and have no data for.
RC> JS>> Sorry. I am no scientist.
RC> You are a superstitious old man. Does that mean you are better
RC> qualified than a scientist to state the facts? Get a clue.
JS> Better qualified to state the facts of God.
RC> Better qualified to drool forth your pathetic superstitions, yes.
RC> Would YOU torture babies in hell?
No.
... Rejoice in the Lord always: and again I say, Rejoice. (Phi 4:4)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Staal stinks a little lower
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:50:57
EID:2341 22696640
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 43c901a2
REPLY: 1:123/67.5 331f770c
On (07 Mar 97) Dan Ceppa wrote to All...
-> On 04 Mar 97 06:50:39, Jim Staal got back to Rod Swift
RS> FLORIDA -- State court removed child from lesbian
RS> mother and gave custody to father. Father
RS> is a convicted wife-beater and murderer.
JS> Would that seem to say that a wife-beater and murderer is a better
JS> role model than a lesbian???
DC> Just when I thought you couldn't sink lower than the bottom
DC> of the cesspool, you dig yourself a deeper hole.
DC> You are one big piece of shit, Staal.
yeah, but how about the case where the daughter was taken away from her
lesbian mother and her lover and given to the maternal grandmother after
the little girl testified that her mother and her love had 'licked her
citty-cat'?
... Some shall depart from the faith. - 1 Timothy 4:1
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: Fundy Frolics 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:52:41
EID:7d08 22696680
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 7891e65e
REPLY: 1:103/550.0 331f3a36
On (06 Mar 97) Ken Wiens wrote to Robert Curry...
JS> None are innocent. All suffer the effects of original sin.
JS> Romans 3:23.
KW> RC>Perhaps you might try reading other parts of that bible you thump,
KW> RC>Jimbo. Or have you decided that Ezekiel chapter 18 is not really
a
KW> RC>part of your bible?
KW> Perhaps you should also try reading other parts of the Bible.
KW> Ezekiel is speaking of the guilt of the father's sin never
KW> being held against the sons. Moses, on the other hand,
KW> in Exodus 20:5 has in view the consequences of the fathers
KW> sins. Psalm 51:5 says that even from birth man is polluted
KW> with sin. Psalm 58:3 confirms the same, as does Ephesians
KW> 2:3 and many other passages. Take your own advice. Read
KW> the Bible thoroughly on this subject. Get yourself a good,
KW> comprehensive concordence and trace the topic thru the
KW> Bible.
KW> RC>Even better than babbling bible verses, try thinking for
KW> RC>a change.
KW> Add to thinking thorough study of your subject before
KW> commenting on it.
An excellent response.
... Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good. (Rom 12:21)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: My Summer Weekend
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:54:18
EID:9267 226966c0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 ff869188
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 331fdd54
On (07 Mar 97) Richard Smith wrote to Christopher Hughes...
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Jim Staal said to Christopher Hughes about My Summer Weekend:
CH> Jim, you obviously have a screw loose somewhere. I should
CH> think it's pretty clear to you by now that my husband is
CH> an atheist.
RS> js> How come you both call each other 'husband'? Marriage
RS> js> consists of husband and wife.
RS> You know, coming from someone that hints at/hides a history
RS> of fellatio,
Where?
... Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. (Eph 5:10)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: jesus needed...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:55:33
EID:6384 226966e0
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 73e3501f
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 331ed358
On (06 Mar 97) Richard Smith wrote to All...
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Jim Staal said to Rod Swift about jesus needed...:
js> BZZZT! WRONG! Jesus is God. God clearly does _not_
js> love everyone.
RS> FAQ! FAQ!
Yeah, my previous statements on the subject are probably already there.
... Continue in prayer, and watch in the same with thanksgiving. (Col 4:2)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Staalin's 2nd Girly
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:56:32
EID:fd65 22696700
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 72a2eb58
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 331ef3ee
On (06 Mar 97) Richard Smith wrote to All...
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Jim Staal said to Rod Swift about the promise keepers 1/:
js> A better man is what they make out of me. :)
RS> This makes the 2nd girly that Staalin has managed to achieve
RS> in this message packet. He's getting quite limp-wristed.
Why do you not quote the context in which these statements were given?
... Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. (Eph 6:1)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Staalin's 3rd Girly
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:56:59
EID:3469 22696700
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 95b37cea
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 331ef42c
On (06 Mar 97) Richard Smith wrote to All...
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Jim Staal said to Rod Swift about Oops, Caught Again:
js> They will, and I'll be there to witness it. :)
RS> Here's Staalin's 3rd girly. He'll probably begin
RS> cross-dressing now . . .
This makes no sense whatsoever.
... For he that is dead is freed from sin. (Rom 6:7)
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Cheese Whiz
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:57:27
EID:61f9 22696720
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 35129fe1
REPLY: 1:203/9046.0 331ef866
On (06 Mar 97) Richard Smith wrote to Judith Bandsma...
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Jim Staal said to Judith Bandsma about Cheese Whiz:
JB> I repeat...you need an anatomy book.
RS> js> Yeah, and you need a...aw, forget it!
RS> Judith, you have to remember not to use the Harpy Glare at
RS> full power with people with miniscule intellects. Now
RS> you've frightened poor Jimson out of his wit.
That is why you obviously have me twitted or just chose not to do the
manly thing and respond to my posts to you.
... Judge not according to appearance. - John 7:24
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Jim Staal
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Promisekritters
|Date: 09 Mar 97 12:59:05
EID:b812 22696760
MSGID: 1:228/45.5 f86ae195
REPLY: 3:690/660.0 331ead7a
On (06 Mar 97) Rod Swift wrote to Dan Ceppa...
RS> * On 01-03-97 at 15:37, DAN CEPPA wrote to KATHERINE WINTERSNIGHT,
RS> on the topic of "Promisekritters" in echo Holysmoke:
DC> KW> And I don't think that a PK type is any more capable of learning
than
DC> KW> a pig is of singing.
DC> Doesn't Jim Staal claim to be able to sing?
RS> Doesn't Jim Staal claim to be a pig?
No.
... He that denieth the faith, and is worse than an infidel. - 1 Tim. 5:8
--- PPoint 2.00
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|From: Norman Solomon
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: Humanism
|Date: 07 Mar 97 20:11:00
EID:8401 2267a160
MSGID: 2:2501/217@fidonet.org d6d2e803
-=> Quoting Marilyn Burge to Norman Solomon <=-
MB> On (21 Feb 97) Norman Solomon babbled to Marilyn Burge...
Hi Marilyn
NS> The pain must run very deep, they are messing in the relms of
NS> self esteem and identity. The scars left must be horrific,
NS> and merit the wrath of this echo.
MB> That's the way I see it. While I find much of the out-and-out
MB> taunting to be unproductive, I can certainly understand where it
MB> is coming from, and empathisize with the person who's doing it (as
MB> well as with the target).
I've just had my 2400 modem updated to a 28800, so I am switching back
to the echo in full. But I am very behind with mail at the mo', perhaps
I can be of some help.
MB> On the other hand, there are Christians who deserve the
MB> hostility they receive here, given how fuckedup their views
MB> are. (see above)
NS> Let us hope "As they sow so shall they reap" Not that that
NS> will be any compensation to those who have suffered.
MB> We're doing our bloody best.
Count me in, sleaves rolled up and all.
MB> It's a clear-cut case of a bunch of believers thinking that
MB> their sins aren't as bad as the next guy's.
NS> I have come across this in England, sin can be an all
NS> together "fasionable" concept, boundaries changing like
NS> hem-lines. Can't these people see that they are being
NS> manipulated?
NS> Secular society ought to be neutral, making laws if you will
NS> to protect society, not Hijacked to any individual, or
NS> corporate group. It is up to us to decide upon our own
NS> personal laws, set our own boundaries. Ask others to respect
NS> them sure, but legislate them never!
MB> That's the scarey part; these idiots want to turn the United State
MB> of America into a theocracy. They may succeed, but not without one
MB> helluva fight on my part.
Scares me too, the US is the only real super-power at the moment.
NS> Moral "law" must be internalised to be effective, where as
NS> moral "law" externally enforced is next to useless, a blunt
NS> instrumnet.
MB> I've often said that virtue is what you do when nobody is looking
MB> and there is zero chance of getting caught. If I'm right, there's
MB> damned few of us that have much virtue, regardless of religious
MB> affiliation. But, judging from what I've seen, the scant supply
MB> that there is certainly isn't overweighted toward christians.
100% agreed, there is good in many even non-thiest philosophies.
MB> And, on that note, it occurs to me that making laws mandating
MB> virtue is counterproductive. If there's a law that says I must be
MB> virtuout, I'll never know for sure whether I have internalized my
MB> virtue, or whether I am simply being virtuous because it's against
MB> the law to be otherwise. Given that, I would think that even the
MB> fundies could see the virtue (pun intended) of a society as free
MB> as possible, so we all have the proper incentive to build a proper
MB> backbone.
What if the nature of a person could be changed, then we would be
the law "made flesh", sounds like heaven to me.
Norman
======
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|From: Norman Solomon
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 07 Mar 97 20:56:00
EID:c50c 2267a700
MSGID: 2:2501/217@fidonet.org 2b0cee70
-=> Quoting Marilyn Burge to Norman Solomon <=-
MB> On (21 Feb 97) Norman Solomon babbled to Marilyn Burge...
Hi Marilyn
NS> If you are refering to the bible, you are in error. You are
NS> not taking into account the time frame.
NS> God created everything and it was good, then man fell and
NS> creation was corupted as result. By all means argue with Ken,
NS> but if you are going to say the bible says.......then get it
NS> right.
MB> Check out Isaiah. Jehovah pounds his chest, sings three
MB> choruses of "Macho, Macho Man," and sez:
NS> Don't over egg the mix :-)
MB> I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and
MB> create evil: I the LORD do all these things. Isaiah 45:7
MB> So, you see, Dan is correct.
NS> I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and
NS> create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things. Isaiah
NS> 45:7 (NIV)
MB> I see little difference between creating evil and creating
MB> disaster. You are getting into semantics here, but it seems to me
MB> that either way, he created something that was obviously very
MB> hurtful (by his own, first-person admission), knowing what it
MB> would mean to us mere mortals that he did.
Yes I see what you mean, but I was dealing with the specific accusation
that God had admitted creating evil in the first person. The admission
to bring disaster, is consistant however. *If* you then *I* logic.
NS> Not quite, the time frame is key, this is post fall.
NS> Therefore one has to engage the "because" in Gen 3 making
NS> this Because *you* *I*
MB> I don't think so, as it is talking about CREATION here, so it
MB> seems to me to be a digression or recollection of what his
MB> creation is.
Disagree, created perfect, now fallen, and cursed (Gen 3:18), well at least
from the biblical POV. Perfectly valid IMHO to hold another POV, but not
to express it as biblical ISWIM.
DC> So, your god didn't create everything. Seems like your book
DC> is wrong.
NS> All that seems to be at fault here is your ability to
NS> comprehend the biblical version of creation.
MB> Check it out. He even bragged about doing it. He took
MB> "credit" for creating evil, in the first person, yet.
NS> Not evil, blessing or curse, "prosperity or disaster". That
NS> makes it consistant with Gen 3. "Peace or evil" are not a
NS> logical pair, but that's your speciality so look forward with
NS> great interest to hearing your view.
MB> I think you are soft-pedaling the obvious. Given that he allegedly
MB> flooded all the Earth, put the two trees in the Garden, etc., it
MB> seems to me that he has to accept full responsibility for evil
MB> existing on this Earth. If not, who put the Tree of the Knowledge
MB> of Good and Evil and the Tree of Life in the Garden to begin with?
I don't follow your logic here providing the means to do both good or
evil does not make God culpable Knowledge is not of course evil
that comes with the application and it is the application that is open
to judgement as to if good or evil.
MB> Either god created everything, or else he is not omnipotent. If he
How so? It's the "either" "or" statement I don't follow.
MB> created everything, which the bible pretty clearly says, then he
MB> must take blame as well as credit for whatever is here, both good
MB> and bad.
No the biblical perspective is created perfect, then he is all done
creating. Then the fall, then the curse DYSWIM?
Norman
======
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|From: Norman Solomon
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Christ-Like
|Date: 07 Mar 97 21:47:00
EID:6245 2267ade0
MSGID: 2:2501/217@fidonet.org 0103cd79
-=> Quoting Jim Staal to Norman Solomon <=-
Hi Jim
JS> On (24 Feb 97) Mark Kimes wrote to Norman Solomon...
MK> NS>>> Which Christian theology is this then?
MK> HP>> The xtian theology in which "all [including infants] have
MK> sinned"
NS> I was looking for a lable, ie; Anglican, Roman Catholic etc.
MK> Sorry, I don't "hold those views personally," but I did refer you to
MK> someone who'd just finished repeating those personally-held views in
MK> this very echo: Jim Staal. That should enable you to obtain exactly
MK> the information you seek.
JS> Hi, Norman. I know for sure that Calvinistic denominations (Christian
JS> Reformed, Reformed Church of America, Protestant Reformed Church,
JS> Netherlands Reformed Church) as well as any and all who have read and
JS> understood the book of Romans hold to the theology of 'original sin'.
So which are you first a calvinist or a Christian?
JS> (Rom 3:23 NIV) for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of
JS> God,
JS> (1 Cor 15:22 NIV) For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be
JS> made alive.
JS> (1 Cor 15:23 NIV) But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits;
JS> then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
JS> (Rom 5:12 NIV) Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one
JS> man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men,
JS> because all sinned--
JS> (Rom 5:15 NIV) But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many
JS> died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and
JS> the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow
JS> to the many!
JS> Hope this has been helpful.
Not really Jim, you see I was looking for a human response, a heartfelt
response. Even Satan can quote scripture. All I can determin is that
you have an NIV, and a good grasp of Justification by faith, imputed
righteousness et-al.
What is the product of this in you? Are you not outraged by the things
that are perp. in the name of Christ in your land? Are you even touched
by the pain expressed by some posters in here?
(Rom 13:8 NIV) "Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt
to love one another, for he who loves his fellow man has fulfilled the
law"
That love and respect, to be of God, has to be unconditional don't you
think?
Norman
======
JS> ... For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. (1 Cor 13:9)
JS> -!- PPoint 2.00
JS> ! Origin: God's Advocate (1:228/45.5)
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|From: Norman Solomon
|To: Bryson Hughes
|Sub: Cross Posting???
|Date: 07 Mar 97 22:51:00
EID:b87f 2267b660
MSGID: 2:2501/217@fidonet.org e6e5870d
-=> Quoting Bryson Hughes to Norman Solomon <=-
NS> I would like some advice please.
[snip]
BH> Feel free to share anything I put in and share about the scene
BH> in England yourself. I have a Messianic Jewish ministry and am
BH> always anxious to reach out to people. Even you across the sea.
Thanks, somehow I feel sure you will get cross-posted :)
I am curious though, a ministry to the jews? How would this differ from
a
ministry to the gentiles?
Norman
======
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: David Rice
|Sub: CRACKER BARREL BOYCOT
|Date: 08 Mar 97 18:54:00
EID:2f69 226896c0
-=> Quoting David Rice to Rod Swift <=-
DR> I've read about the proposed AIDS victim concentration
DR> camps; the proposed international database to keep track
DR> of AIDS victims; the proposed criminal laws against AIDS
DR> victims who do not advertise their afliction.
All excellent ideas IMHO. What do you have against any of them?
How better to contain an epidemic than by isolating the carriers
from the healthy?
We used to quarantine measles victims, why not AIDS victims?
Why shouldn't we punish anyone who knowingly passes on a
fatal illness?
... I've got a mind like a... a... what's that thing called?
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Martin Goldberg
|Sub: CRACKER BARREL BOYCOT
|Date: 08 Mar 97 18:56:00
EID:0e82 22689700
-=> Quoting Martin Goldberg to Roger Hunter <=-
MG> It's too bad that wrods like that have a connotation that make them
MG> act as denigraters when used. Just looking it up int he dictionary
MG> should be sufficient, but "abnormal" gives most people the picture of
MG> multi loci mutagenized organisms that break cameras, stop clocks, and
MG> drink the blood of small children.
Well sure, but you must remember, half the population of the U. S.
is below average in intelligence .
... Take my advice, I don't use it anyway.
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Ed Mills
|Sub: CRACKER BARREL BOYCOT
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:07:00
EID:d501 226898e0
-=> Quoting Ed Mills to Roger Hunter <=-
RH> I've been considering a double barreled hand shotgun. It will
RH> hold either a .410 shotgun shell or a 45 caliber pistol shell.
RH> Seems like just the thing to repel boarders in my camper...
RH> This is a pistol, BTW, with about 5" barrels.
EM> Never saw that. I've seen the derringer of that caliber, though.
This looks like a derringer but with longer barrels.
EM> Which is also available in .44 magnum, if you want some real
EM> seriously masochistic recoil. The other thing I'm reminded of
No, too much time off-target.
EM> is the Thunder Five, a .410/.45 revolver which looks like an
EM> S&W .38 snub on steroids.
Now THAT sounds interesting. Still made? Two shots may not
always be enough.
... Ok, I pulled the pin. Now what? Where are you going?
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: HOMOSEXUALS ALSO REPR
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:35:00
EID:d3bd 22689c60
-=> Quoting Rod Swift to Roger Hunter <=-
RS> Your error is assumption 2. A homosexual couple can be any
RS> couple of the same sex, or a couple in which each member is
RS> homosexual. A homosexual couple could be a gay man and a lesbian
RS> who are having heterosexual genital intercourse.
Ok. I was assuming that "couple" had a relationship connotation
here, as in "married couple" as opposed to two friends.
Now why and how could a gay man have intercourse with a lesbian?
Isn't that repugnant to both? If a gay man dislikes having sex
with a female, why is it better with a lesbian female?
RS> I know of many situations in which 4 is quite real.
RS> You have also forgotten about bisexual people.
I was considering them as a separate category.
... Psycho-ceramics: The study of crackpots
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: KEN YOUNG: POSTER CHI
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:44:00
EID:3d1c 22689d80
-=> Quoting Rod Swift to Ken Young <=-
RS> If not, I suggest you start looking at some of the studies of
RS> people who have done it before you and *TIME AND TIME* again have
RS> received a result that 98% or so of gay people say they *never
RS> chose*.
Ah Hell, Rod, I think I chose. I compared an asshole to a cunt
and the asshole had a slight edge. But then I looked at the
life-support systems for each and decided to be straight.
... Ok, I pulled the pin. Now what? Where are you going?
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: LUNATIC BUTTFUCKS
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:48:00
EID:c5f9 22689e00
-=> Quoting Ken Wiens to Robert Curry <=-
KW> 3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will
KW> come with {their} mocking, following after their own lusts,
KW> 4and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For {ever}
KW> since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was
KW> from the beginning of creation."
See, there were reasonable people even back then.
KW> 5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by
KW> the word of God {the} heavens existed long ago and {the} earth
KW> was formed out of water and by water,
KW> 6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded
KW> with water.
KW> 7But the present heavens and earth by His word are being reserved
KW> for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly
KW> men.
KW> 8But do not let this one {fact} escape your notice, beloved, that
KW> with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years
KW> as one day.
KW> 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness,
KW> but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for
KW> all to come to repentance.
KW> (NAS)
But the fundies were no smarter then either. All of the above is
non sequiter.
... (hic) BWave 2.10 (hic) BWave 2.10 * My computer is drunk ...
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|From: Roger Hunter
|To: Robert Curry
|Sub: MILLENNIUM LUNACY
|Date: 08 Mar 97 19:55:00
EID:c0ab 22689ee0
-=> Quoting Robert Curry to Roger Hunter <=-
RC> It sounds odd because it is phrased oddly. The *year* is the first;
RC> the *age* is zero. (Years are counted ordinally; age, cardinally).
That's why 6 months old means "zero years, 6 months" old.
RC> The difference is that there are two usages here, the ordinal usage
RC> (first, second, third, etc.) to count the order of the years -- plus
RC> the cardinal usage (zero, one, two, etc.) to tell how many years
RC> someone has already lived. Sure, you understand it and I understand
RC> it; most anyone does (although the terms "ordinal" and "cardinal" may
RC> be unfamiliar to many). John, however, has problems.
John's problem is in insisting that "first" means "one". Usually, it
does. "Here is a marble, the first. You now have one". But not always;
the first integer is zero.
... I'm not paranoid.. Which Of my enemies told you this?
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12
--- FLAME v1.1
* Origin: The Grotto - Arvada, CO (303) 421-7186 V.32bis (1:104/251)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Bryson Hughes
|Sub: Are U a God ?
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:38:00
EID:49f3 2268acc0
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225810
BH>In my case, my eyes were opened continually to see like the prophet Enoch
or
BH>Elijah. I recieve revelation in several of the ways I noted above. One
of th
BH>striking blends of modern thought and revelation, is the revelation by
BH>telepathy.
BH>I have come to realize that I am aware of reality, and the illusion is
BH>of NOT being able to percieve it experienced by most people.
I have come to relize that I am NOT aware of reality, and the illusion
is of being able to perceive it, as experience by most people.
Fuck, doesn't ryme, either way.
BH>... PROPHET BRYSON and The ANGELS -***- WORLD * TOUR -***- 1997
So ??? what sex is the angel ? male/female/neither ?
* SLMR 2.1a * * Anything U say will be misquoted & used against You. **
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: CRACKER BARREL BOYCOT
|Date: 08 Mar 97 21:44:00
EID:2eae 2268ad80
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225811
RH> -=> Quoting Fredric Rice to David Rice <=-
RH> dr> Many homosexual couples are not the same gender.
RH> FR> I tried explaining this to the guy and he still doesn't seem capable
RH> FR> of understanding. It's too simple, I think. He may be looking
for a
RH> FR> complex reason and simply can't accept the obvious.
RH>Oh, I understand you all right, I just have difficulty with the
RH>idea of a mixed gender couple, both gay, having an enjoyable sexual
RH>relationship. It would seem repugnant to both of them, by definition.
But the topic started off, if a gay couple/person could have/create
a baby. Don't need to enjoy the sex act, just to pop a kid out.
* SLMR 2.1a * * Depression is merely anger without too much enthusiasm
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: It's a Harp.It's a Harp.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:14:00
EID:112c 226909c0
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225812
RS>... Proud Member: Harpies Ground Support League
* SLMR 2.1a * Harp missile: Ground to Harpies ...Shoot_them_up League.
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Steve Quarrella
|Sub: .
|Date: 08 Mar 97 22:15:00
EID:13e9 2268b1e0
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225813
> CC> manner. I feel sorry for them because they will have to answer to
that
SQ>Quick, Katherine! Reel him in before he goes under the boat!
> CC> provided through His Son, Jesus Christ (Cf. Hebrews 2:3). Whether
or n
> CC> you have done so, I do not know, but if you haven't (and I question
> CC> whether you have based on what I have read that YOU have written),
then
> CC> you are headed for a Godless enternity. Don't say that you will have
m
> CC> friends there. There you will have NO friends. I am your friend,
beca
> CC> I am concerned for your soul.
SQ>Gee whiz, that's great. That's the first time I've heard that....
And if that pickup line doesn't work, a few drinks may help.
* SLMR 2.1a * ** If it ain't broke , give Katherine a shot at it. **
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: .?
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:16:00
EID:8445 22690a00
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225814
RS>BH> ... PROPHET BRYSON and The ANGELS -***- WORLD * TOUR -***- 1997
RS>BH> * Origin: Skeeter Haven "Nashville, TN" (615) 872-8609 (1:116/17)
RS>Ah, you're in the same place as Al. It must be the water.
First you say this, then you have the odasity in the
next reply to request. . .
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
Date: 03-04-97 (21:04)
From: ROD SWIFT
To: BRYSON HUGHES
Subj: asaity
-----------------------
BH> Ok we can talk about the existance of God if you like.
-We'd rather you present proof of the existence of God. That's
-what we like :) We've not had much liking in that topic,
-however, because no one has ever done the task...
-----------------------
Now Rod. Don't go fundy on us. ie: "proof"
Either that, or it the booze,since you did make
another error also. Like i should talk.
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
[[[[[[ Hellion Attack ]]]]]]
Got u.
* SLMR 2.1a * * Anything U say will be misquoted & used against You. **
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Skeptic Tank Staff M 1/2
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:30:00
EID:251e 226903c0
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225815
==============
side note Rod, I house clean and lost/moved the dictionary..
Be warned I'm guessing on words and i know it.
=============
>> >RV> Rod would be the one, going by this area. To Cover that topic.
>RV> RS>Accepted :)
>RV> It would appear that you can handel it quit well. Proper spelling and
>RV> pose style , plus knowledge and willing to be upfront. With most
>RV> of the anti-style of postings, i have seen. They make my style of
>RV> writeing, look almost, not bad.
RS>Read my previous post to Martin about the abuse/use of
RS>terminology by the religious right in most debates of
RS>homosexuality/bisexuality/heterosexuality/anysexuality.
I did , I will also try it on the thumpers the next
time they drop by. See if they can see it.
>RV> Such power that a gay person has...usually males... if not for
>RV> the gay power, there wouldn't be any homophobe, assholes/people.
RS>The unfortunate thing is that gay and lesbian visibility has no
RS>bearing on anti-gay violence. In fact, greater visibility
RS>equates to greater reporting of the crimes, and hence *less*
RS>crimes happening because gays don't fear going to police.
It's like more rapes are now reported, child abuse is now
reported, etc. It's not likely that there is more of it
happening/density/population growth/ compare to the pass. It
just a case, less of it is swept under the carpet.
With the gay population, it's not lack of church going or loss
of morals causeing people to take up so called sinful ways. It's
just that more people are feeling safer to admit their lifestyle
happens to be this way. Same as nowadays it is a bit less of
a crass lifestyle to admit that some couples, Don't Want Children.
RS>There has been a reduction in hate crimes (slightly) since last
RS>year's statistics, says the HRC.
Yup. The hate crimes, seem to be lower in Canada, also.
RS>Of course, ten years ago, gay bashings were slightly less than
RS>the number of cases reported now, but there were a fraction
RS>reported then, and a lot more now.
RS>We can never know the true number of cases in the past because we
RS>can't expect now to get accurate data for crimes more than 10
RS>years ago. But we do know that visibility and presence, and
RS>hence the moral outrage at the slaying of gay people and the hate
RS>crimes, diminishes them.
Some times socity needs an in your face approach, just to get
said socity to admit that blacks/women/jews/gays/what ever are
just people. Also to admit that because they are human they
should also be treated as humans.
There is an announcer at CFRB Prg.time
8:00 pm to 10:00 pm. He's a fundy christian, smart man, good
talker ofcourse. He's been comeing down of the gay theater group
and gays in general. Ie: makeing as sinners, makeing as stupid
,makeing as corrupter of youth, etc.etc. I've made it through
to the director a few times, and never made it yet to him. Then
too, he's anti-abortion but lord help the group that teach
highschool students about comdom useage. Ie: pushing bad moral
teaching, giveing the Ok for kids
to have sex outside of marrage.
Of course all these bad/sinful ways are because socity as a
norm is falling into more sinful ways all the time. You want Proof
the announcer says, Well just look at all the people takeing
up the gay lifestyle , all
the abuse of kids , all
the rapes of people , all
the marrage breakups .
But be brave, Jesus is comeing. He does at times, really get on
this reglious kick, and Yes Rod, it's those poor fucking people
who chose a gay lifestyle that really get the brunt of the anti-human
message that he comes out with. ie: do note CHOSE what u are...
He's had gay leaders on the show, and then he says...right ok
god made you this way....BUT>>> If you really wantted to, you
could be straight like me. Like I said, as sharp talker, but
boy-o-boy in some areas, he does need a [ Clue X 4 ]
>> RS>Hence gays should go away, rather than homophobes seek help for
>> RS>their illogical violence.
>RV> Like the women, like the blacks, like the Jews, like the RV> own>
RS>Witches, pagans, communists, welfare mothers, etc, etc. Who is
RS>the next targets of the Christian Soldiers? I think welfare
RS>mothers, the school teachers, and Wiccans and Muslims are the
RS>next collective targets, with a renewal on abortion.
Well Rod, your not alone. As a white male, i will abuse women, abuse
kids, abuse color folks, steal,kill. Hell Rod, it's so bad anymore
i really wonder if i would help a lost child, if i didn't have
female company with me at the time. Youes a white male, youes just
evil man, real evil.
Bring up that Muslim bit. Last fri. same person as above.
Had a Muslim leader on the show............ He slip up and they
really got into it a bit. Funny, really. They had to take a break when
it wasn't needed. The Fundy Christian will really get on great
with the Fundy Muslim. Same God, same Jesus, but they still got into
a pissing match.
RS>They're currently using homosexuality as the #1 fundraiser, but
RS>realise that research will soon eliminate homosexuality as a
RS>"problem", and only the shrill morons on the fringes will be left
RS>making fools of themselves claiming it's "wrong".
Seems to me, I heard that the RC Church is admitting that
gay people and the gay lifestyle is now allowed/admitted
as NOT a sin or something. I wasn't really listening and they
never mention it again. What ever it was, they are opening up
the RC church to gay people.
Something about, it was time the RC church was a leader and not
a follower, or something like that.
>RV> I've all ready have the title of Satan's mouth piece, Queer Lover,
>RV> None Human, etc..etc.. So far, they haven't classed me as a Jesus
>RV> lover, so I haven't slip down that far yet.
RS>Oh, really? :) :) Well, that's good.
>>> Continued to next message
* SLMR 2.1a * "Psalsm 137:9 - Fun For The Whole Family"
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Skeptic Tank Staff M 2/2
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:30:00
EID:25ee 226903c0
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225816
>>> Continued from previous message
RS>Fight the good fight, which is normally the one that isn't the
RS>majority's :)
The number of times i been ask if i was queer/gay/whatever. I
usually response as, not yet, give me time. Along that line, it
just stirs up the pot a bit more, since i didn't get upset or
even denie it. Even today, like in the pass, for some people, to
be classed as gay, is as good as being dead. It's a real rude
remark to make to a male. I guess. well it was in the pass
anyhow.
RS>And now that news story:
RS>From Westside Observer, 13 February 1997, page 1:
RS>MASSACRE THREAT
RS>Right-wing Tassie group says Mardi Gras bloodbath 'inevitable'
RS>By Gavin McGuren and Danae Gibson
RS>A far right-wing Christian group based in Tasmania has declared
RS>that a massacre at the Sydney Gay and Lesbian Mardi Gras [held
RS>during the last weekend of February -- rod] is inevitable if the
RS>event continues to be staged, and the gay and lesbian community
RS>will be to blame for it.
1'st ...Thank you Rod.
2'nd ...Thats about the way it's played up here on
some of the radio talk shows.
If those dam queers would just shut the fuck up and go back
in hidding, we wouldn't have to kill them. Christ, thats fucking
sick.
Then too, if they can fuck over kids for god, well, whats a
little killing of queers.
Like i said before, Humans are stupid. Dangerious, but stupid.
* SLMR 2.1a * "Psalsm 137:9 - Fun For The Whole Family"
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: To prove or not to prove
|Date: 09 Mar 97 00:41:00
EID:d3c4 22690520
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225817
RS>RV> RS>Now, on the other hand, science has proven the origins of
RS>RV> RS>religion, and you do have one of the reasons firmly in grip --
RS>RV> RS>child indoctrination and abuse at an early age.
RS>RV> "proven" ????? Your sure about that ? Toss in a 'showen', then
RS>RV> we {me/myself&I}, can/may agree. 'evidence'
RS>RV> 'pointed to'
RS>RV> 'allied'
RS>Proven that it comes from childhood indoctrination, adult
RS>conversion, and superstition. In groups of humans that have no
RS>such indoctrination of a religion, that religion does *not*
RS>propagate.
Who created the gods ? The Child or the Adult. We are talking
about the start of the god trade here, not this day and age.
Besides, i didn't know that science was in the proveing bit.
RS>Religions spread through human interaction. We should practice
RS>effective mental disease control measures, which may or may not
RS>involve using a condom :) :)
RS>Then again, others would remind us that religion is a condom for
RS>the brain, to do the antithesis of the above -- to stop "effective
RS>mental thoughts".
Brain death does that. Just pull it over the head and tie it off.
Three minutes and we have a Brand New... Born Again Christian, who
will never have an orginal thought again.
RS> * OLX 2.1 TD * The only rational solution to your problem is suicide
* SLMR 2.1a * "Rain Forest Echosystems of the Nevada Dessert"
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: Ronald Vass
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Christians Love Hateing
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:11:00
EID:3ac3 22690960
MSGID: 1:221/1503 33225818
>> RS>Homosexuality is their biggest money earner at the moment. Since
>> RS>it earns heaps of money to the big purses of the church leaders,
>> RS>naturally they bring it up at every possibility.
>> RS>And the old adage -- if you repeat it over and over again, even
>> RS>if it is not true, it becomes "truth" -- is apparent.
>RV> The Christians are just takeing a lesson from that other
>RV> good Christian, Hitler. He showed a lie, repeated offen enought
>RV> -is/will be- accepted as truth after a while.
RS>Taking a lesson? They have his whole manifesto of debase, incite
RS>hate, and destroy.
Fair is fair. Hitler got the idea from the RC church, now the
offbeat fundy christians, grabed it from the fundy Hitler.
RS>That is why the price of peace is eternal vigilance, and why the
RS>words "never again" have such special meaning to some.
And the fact, it's tossed in their face,just drags out all
those brain_dead_redneck_christians, who will do the lords work.
>RV> Gay male --- homo man === pedophilia in this local. If a homo??
>RV> well you just attack kids, usually very young boys. No way can
>RV> people keep apart the difference or perhaps they don't want to.
>RV> To show them that Hetro males are more offen the offender is
>RV> just brush aside as a very rare happening.
RS>Here's a quote...
RS>"For centuries, dominant groups in society have used the 'they're after
your
RS>kids' myth to marginalize subdominant groups. The stories change, but
the
RS>pattern is always the same. In nineteenth-century Russia, Jews were
RS>supposedly after Christian children to use their blood in the Passover
Seder
RS>a convenient fiction which was used to justify pogroms by the Christian
RS>majority; in early-twentieth-century America, the need to protect the
RS>sanctity of young white females was used as a pretext for the lynching
of
RS>twelve hundred black men between 1900 and 1940; and today, the far Right
RS>ignores statistics that show heterosexual men (not gay men, not straight
RS>women, not lesbians) are the disproportionate majority of child sexual
RS>abusers . . . ."
Thats a lot of hanging for a 40 year term. No wonder there is so
much rage. You know, that too, is just the tip or the real story.
RS> - Kevin Jennings, founder of the Gay, Lesbian and Straight Teachers
RS>Network (GLSTN), in the anthology "One Teacher in Ten" [ Alyson
RS>Publications, 1994 ]
I've read, or i think i have "Kevin Jennings" and that Alyson pub.
also matchs. Sounds familiar, if it's a murder/or/spy story, then
likely.
It's like i tell my local fundys. When their belief system takes
over the goverment&laws. People like myself, will be on the list
to be gotten rid of. I'm old and smart enought to be a real pain
in their side, I'm too dangerious to be allowed to keep breathing.
* SLMR 2.1a * +Origin: JIHAD NETWORK!: REAL blood and guts for God.
--- Alexi/Mail 2.02b (#10000)
* Origin: *-* Hitler Was A Christian *-* (1:221/1503)
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: Quantum crackpot brawley
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:05
EID:29b1 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6793
TID: GE/2 1.2
RC> See _Infinitesimal Analysis_ by Abraham Robinson.
RC> Or _On Numbers and Games_ by John Conway.
JB> I note that neither of these are in the Washington University
JB> library (which means, since that library is the most extensive
JB> within reach of my interlibrary loan system, I probably cannot
JB> get them).
It means nothing of the sort. You didn't even _ask_ your librarian
about this, did you?
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: death by whining
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:06
EID:ba9a 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6794
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB>>> if I wanted to speak with *&%__you__%&* ("o, wise and
JB>>> superior mathematical expert")),
RC> I daresay that compared to you, most first graders are "wise
RC> and superior mathematical experts," John.
JB>> (*sigh*) Never cease overstating cases, do you?
RC> I meant it seriously and literally. I know first graders who
RC> have a better grasp of mathematical basics than you have
RC> displayed here,
JB> Then, despite your protestations to the contrary, you're
JB> even LESS even-minded, MORE egotistical, than me.
Ah, this is this first I've heard of my "protestations to the
contrary." Would you be kind enough to share them with me? :-)
RC> including a better grasp of adding and subtracting on a number
RC> line.
JB> Robert, I _grasp_ your zero-block-containing number line just
JB> _fine_.
Then allow me to rephrase: I know first graders who can and do
better _demonstrate_ their grasp of mathematical basics than you
do here, including a better demonstration of their ability to
conceptualize adding and subtracting on a number line.
JB> Moreover, I need to understand why it seems to be the case
JB> that I can't map a discrete math onto a continuous one without
JB> "losing information."
It's becoming clear that you parrot people (this time, Chris Hughes).
JB>> Sure! "I disseminate mathematical misinformation."
RC> Congratulations. To admit that you have a problem is the most
RC> important step in learning to overcome it.
JB> See the quotes?
JB> I was asked to say something.
JB> I said it.
So if someone pulls your string, you turn into a Liar Appleton?
Now that's pretty pathetic. At least you did manage to tell the
truth while so carefully distancing yourself from it.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: responsibility
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:07
EID:9a7e 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6795
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB>> Did you READ the Berlinski book, or are you just talkin'
JB>> through your hat?
RC> Apparantly an elephant could sneak around your inattentiveness,
RC> John.
JB> We can _both_ blame something real for part of these
JB> misunderstandings: Fido's variable transmission rates.
JB> Our messages are crossing.
And so you naturally jump the gun to presume things that you really
should know much better than to presume.
Then you (again!) try to shift blame for your own mistake to anyone
or anything else. Once, "math-type people in PHYSICS" were the
culprits; then Berlinski; now it is all Fido's fault. Never your own.
* SLMR 2.1a *
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: !
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:08
EID:7cfd 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6796
TID: GE/2 1.2
RC>> So who was it that hated you enough to suggest Berlinski?
JB>> I saw a blurb in _Science_News_, which I trust, and bought it.
RC> So you fall for ads, but balk at doing a little research at a
RC> library.
JB> You don't respect _Science_News_ enough to suppose it doesn't
JB> print frivolous ads?
Do you know the difference between a paid advertisement and a book
review, John?
JB> I take responsibility for _everything_ I do.
You hide it well.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: John-boy's x=1
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:09
EID:b4ef 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6797
TID: GE/2 1.2
RC> So use a discrete metric that takes on the nonnegative
RC> integers as possible values, and the answer is exactly one.
RC> That will provide you with a perfectly good solution, John.
JB> (*sigh*) Have done.
And when, more or less, did that change occur?
JB> Not the problem. I want to _justify_the_axioms_themselves_.
Not a math problem.
While I can certainly produce for you many of the tools from
standard math (that you are unaware of) in finding a suitable
model and axioms to fit, any motivational or "justification"
issues are for you to deal with if you wish to obsess over them.
RC> Now if you later have concerns about proving this solution
RC> is unique (that there can be no other logical possibilities),
RC> that's a more involved and difficult matter. Nonetheless,
RC> I have provided what you asked for: the math.
JB> You state the problem closely, but "later" is not the time
JB> for that. It's "out of sequence" to do it that way. "Precept
JB> must be upon precept."
Demonstrations of existence always come before demonstrations of
uniqueness. How could you prove something is unique before even
proving it exists, after all?
"Out of sequence?"
Please tell me again how you are not suffering from excessive egotism.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: counting on a number line
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:10
EID:6f1d 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6798
TID: GE/2 1.2
RC> In my experience playing math games with dozens of children,
RC> none have ever had any trouble with this very intuitive
RC> notion, John. Think of the number blocks being drawn on a
RC> sidewalk in chalk, with kids standing in any integer's box,
RC> then counting their steps to any other box. It works every
RC> time.
JB> It works, of course.
Earlier, you said it didn't. Glad to see some small improvement
in your comprehension.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: DAN CEPPA
|Sub: Water and Flood.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:11
EID:4d48 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b6799
TID: GE/2 1.2
JS>> The earth also opened up and poured water out, according
JS>> to scripture.
DC>> According to scripture, Jimbo, the earth is flat.
RC> Flat and round, like a pancake.
DC> Yeah, put it was full of TANKS! to hold that excess 2
DC> hydrospheres of non-existant water.
And it's regular polygons all the way down.
DC> ... "Jesus has a temper tantrum and screams 'EAT ME!": Sam Kineson
Heh. I remember that one from the show he put on in Tampa (at the
Performing Arts Center, of all places).
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: KEN YOUNG
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:12
EID:33b9 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679a
TID: GE/2 1.2
KY> I'd like to be for laws banning homosexual marriage, well,
KY> homosexual sex itself. But, if I am not for their freedoms,
KY> how can I expect anyone be for mine? If I want freedom
KY> and people to respect my right then as much as I hate their
KY> lifestyle, I would have to be for it to be legal.
But:
KY> Now, by the same token, I do believe it is the right of the
KY> people in an area that if they don't like homosexuality,
KY> to vote for anti-homosexual laws.
So you say that you are for human rights applied equally without
discrimination UNLESS some local area decides by mob rule to destroy
the equal application of basic human rights.
You sound like Hitler telling us how he doesn't really hate Jews.
KY>> Rather, what I am speaking of is those gays that make a scene
KY>> about being gay
RC> I have no idea what you mean. Could you elaborate? What kind
RC> of "scene" do you mean?
KY> Check out the gay marches or rallies that have been shown
KY> on the news, and you will get an idea what I mean. You must
KY> admit, some do get a bit confrontational about it.
I still have no idea what you mean. Can you provide a description?
KY> It seems to me that many make their sexual preference the
KY> main part of them.
It seems to you?
KY> I think they obsess far too much in try to get everyone
KY> to accept their lifestyle.
Since when is fighting for equal human rights asking people for
acceptance of a lifestyle, Ken?
KY> I only advertise my distaste for a lifestyle choice, when that
KY> lifestyle choice itself is advertised.
Are you looking over Brawley's shoulder at the adverts in _Science
News_? Just where do you find these advertisements that upset you
so much, I wonder.
You seem to live in a different, more hateful world, Ken.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: KEN YOUNG
|Sub: Driving Mr. Shithead
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:13
EID:b58d 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679b
TID: GE/2 1.2
KY> ANd I can honestly say, it has nothing to do with insecurities,
KY> hatred, or phobias. I don't hate gays, I am fully secure with
KY> who I am, and I could not even think of a reason why I should
KY> be scared of a gay person. The only exception would be I feel
KY> there is a move to indoctrinate people in American society, as
KY> far as homosexuality and the acceptance of it goes.
What would you say to someone who remarked:
"I can honestly say, it has nothing to do with insecurities,
hatred, or phobias. I don't hate blacks, I am fully secure with
who I am, and I could not even think of a reason why I should
be scared of a black person. The only exception would be I feel
there is a move to indoctrinate people in American society, as
far as the acceptance of human rights for blacks goes."
?
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: KEN YOUNG
|Sub: hateful
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:14
EID:8724 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679c
TID: GE/2 1.2
with: Rod Swift
KY>> I may hate the lifestyle, but not the inidividuals.
RC> Why are you so hateful?
KY> I'm not. But everyone has something they hate,
Why are you so hateful, Ken? Let's not run away from the issue
by bringing in everyone else; it's YOUR hatred for what you call
"the lifestyle" which is at issue here.
Why are you so full of this irrational hate?
It does no good to deny it, to bury it. Face it squarely and then
answer the question with a little more honesty if you dare.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: KEN YOUNG
|Sub: flawless info
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:15
EID:e2b5 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679d
TID: GE/2 1.2
with: Fred Rice
FR> Well, Terry? I asked here and in nework mail. Here's try
FR> number 3.
KY> You may disagree with Thompson's views and how she goes
KY> about things, but her evidence and information is flawless.
Is she the source for your "flawless" information about the
sounds of screaming being heard from the ground where people
dug down too close to hell?
KY> The tanks, for instance.. How is it that fire came from
KY> the tanks?
Follow the TANKS! Follow the NOODLES! No, follow the TANKS!
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: KEN YOUNG
|Sub: against everything
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:16
EID:c58d 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679e
TID: GE/2 1.2
KY> I am against Paganism.
You appear to be against a lot of things for no good reason.
KY> Yet, I have Pagan friends I care a great deal about.
KY> I am against the actions, and some of the beliefs, not
KY> the person.
(Sure, and the Christians who tortured and killed heretics were
only against evil demonic infuences, not the people they killed.)
I must wonder, though -- what actions of Pagans are you against?
Although not a Pagan myself, I do not see anything to be "against"
in the actions of those who do identify themselves thusly.
So what is your problem? Are you just indoctrinated with hate?
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: cash only
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:17
EID:f768 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b679f
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB> Gad, man; do you give my black marbles/white marbles analogy
JB> _zero_ credit?
What exactly do you want credit for? You have provided so many
illustrations of your inanity that this one does not stand out
for any particular reason.
JB> How monomaniacal _can_ you be?
Monomaniacal enough to discuss math with virtually anyone.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: a clue
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:18
EID:d3d6 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a0
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB> The _sole_ comment I have ever received from _anyone_, that
JB> even remotely approached the concept-underpinnings I need,
JB> was your "space of one dimension" definition of a "point."
Ahem. Zero dimensional. And it's hardly "my" definition.
JB> The fact that I've been discussing this little problem
JB> with people at least as intelligent as you,
(probably because those with more intelligence know better than
to try talking sense with a lazy and egotistical crackpot)
JB> some of which are perhaps even more mathematically rigorous
JB> than you,
Really? Please name these kindred souls.
JB> strongly suggests that my above opinion was not _unwarranted_.
Actually, it suggests that if you want results, I'm the best person
to provide them for you. After all, you did remark that no one else
has even come close.
Is there a clue lurking somewhere in there for you?
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: .
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:19
EID:78bd 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a1
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB> I bet I'm more "amenable to reason" than, say, Laurie Appleton.
JB> (*chuckle*)
There have been times when you led me to question that.
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: blunder redux
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:20
EID:35bc 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a2
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB>> When Berlinski got beyond the early mention of Leibiz sitting
JB>> in his redoubt and squeezing his fingers together, thinking
JB>> about "the smallest possible number greater than zero,"
RC> Why are you falsely labeling that as an exact quote, John, when
RC> it is nothing more than your mistaken paraphrase?
JB> Pardon me. I assume incorrectly that you are capable of telling
JB> the difference between a direct quote and a set of words set
JB> in quotes because they are an interpretation.
If they are just your own interpretation, a rephrasing in your own
words, it is incorrect to place them in *quotes*, John.
I see that it is your own interpretation, and not Berlinski, which
led you to the mistake about thinking infinitesimals to be discrete.
So are you _finally_ accepting responsibility for that blunder?
JB> Especially since you have the book with you.
That did help me distinguish your worse-than-Appleton "quote" from
the real thing, yes.
RC> Let me know when you decide to give up being an ignoramus
RC> maintaining an ignorant position.
JB> Let _me_ know when you get off your high horse.
Math is my hobby horse, John, and I'll be riding for a lifetime.
The ignorant position at issue, btw, is your earlier insistance
that infinitesimals are all supposedly discrete. Remember?
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: complaints
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:21
EID:bb26 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a3
TID: GE/2 1.2
with: Christopher Hughes
CH> Is that set of points which makes up a line countably or
CH> uncountably infinite,
JB> I'm still having trouble getting a clear definition of these
JB> two types of infinite.
Nothing could be simpler:
A denumerable (or "countable") infinite number is equal to the
number of integers.
A nondenumerable (or "uncountable) infinite number is any that
is larger than the above. A denumerable infinity is the smallest
cardinal infinite number -- the others are all larger.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
* Origin: The 128th Parallel Seminole,Fl 28.8k 813/397-1339 (1:3603/210)
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: LYNDA BUSTILLOZ
|Sub: 'First Cause' Crap
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:22
EID:8b9c 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a4
TID: GE/2 1.2
LB> A three year old can comprehend zero....why can't you?
JB> Jesus, Lynda..... You're smart; learn the difference between
JB> an explorer and an idiot. I can argue these things _because_
JB> I "understand" zero. Who the hell do you think you're talking
JB> to?
You're talking to the man who confused the number zero with the
empty set and also with the contents of the empty set. These are
three different things -- but he "understands" zero. Oh, boy.
JB> She's learning that "zero" and "none" are synonyms. They are
JB> not synonyms, as some here have gone to GREAT PAINS to point out.
Actually, it was "nothing" that was pointed out to him as being a
distinct concept from zero. "None" is a perfectly good synonym.
JB> Zero is either a place-holder ('nothing here', as in "1024"),
That would be the numeral "0" (like the other numerals, a symbol).
JB> or an artificial idea
The Quantum Cuckoo Clock strikes the right time by accident, simply
because *every* number is an artificial idea.
JB> Calling the symbol for the _absence_of_ a number
Never heard of such a thing. The absense of a number? Is it much
like the symbol for the absence of an idiot, do you think?
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
* Origin: The 128th Parallel Seminole,Fl 28.8k 813/397-1339 (1:3603/210)
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: ALL
|Sub: quantum crackpot lunacy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:23
EID:69ad 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a5
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB> "none" exists in a discrete system, but "zero" doesn't.
Much as "salt" exists on a checkered table, but "NaCl" doesn't.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: JOHN BRAWLEY
|Sub: CE
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:24
EID:1255 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a6
TID: GE/2 1.2
JB>> [Jan.---Dec.][Jan.---Dec.][Jan.---Dec.][Jan.---Dec.]
JB>> 2BCE 1BCE 1CE 2CE
RH> FWIW, I agree with the above too. That IS the way they are
RH> numbered. [...] The first year of the CE should have been 0CE.
JB> (*Cackle*) Diehard.
You layed an egg that doubles as an automobile battery?
JB> "Mathematics" it ain't. It's _blocks_. _Labels_ on chunks
JB> (of time).
Would you like to see a series of blocks representing labels on
yearlong chucks of time, John? Quite easy to do _with_ zero.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: STEVE QUARRELLA
|Sub: Give us a kiss!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:36:25
EID:610c 22697480
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a7
TID: GE/2 1.2
directed to: Jesse C. Jones
SQ> I thought of you tonight while I was watching Howard Stern's
SQ> "Private Parts. They had some -really- smarmy lawyers in
SQ> a scene at NBC.
You won't get a kiss that way.
Ciya, however, sends her regards. And her twin sister, Ciya, will
be coming by for fillet of Dopefish whenever you're ready.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
* Origin: The 128th Parallel Seminole,Fl 28.8k 813/397-1339 (1:3603/210)
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: ROGER HUNTER
|Sub: FUNDY FROLICS 1/3
|Date: 09 Mar 97 16:50:26
EID:eebe 22698640
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a8
TID: GE/2 1.2
with: Jim Staal
JS> He jwouldn't do anything that would cause me to stop
JS> worshipping Him. He is who He is in the Bible, and He
JS> cannot/will not change.
RH> I see. Killing all the Amalakites was fine, they were evil.
So evil that they had to be completely exterminated again and again.
RH> Burning babies in Hell is fine.
RH> You really are sick, Staal.
He roasts marshmallows over the flames of tortured babies in hell.
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: ROBERT CURRY
|To: BRYSON HUGHES
|Sub: Prophets
|Date: 09 Mar 97 16:50:27
EID:b8c1 22698640
MSGID: 1:3603/210 455b67a9
TID: GE/2 1.2
BH> By chance, my wife checked out a book from her college
BH> library, which was the Medical encyclopedia. I was intrigued
BH> so I began reading it. I came to a poem on page 23, which
BH> was supposed to be an extreme example of chaotic speech.
BH> I read it and began to marvel at how hip the author was.
BH> I understood every word and line, until it finally hit me
BH> that I wrote it 15 years previously at the request of the
BH> psychiatrist. It even had my name in it.
Title or ISBN?
* SLMR 2.1a *
--- GEcho/2 1.20/Pro
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: helpless moron from oz
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:39
EID:2296 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF Rod = Swift THEN David Worrell ELSE helpless moron from oz
RS> No no no. You don't understand, David. We make fun OF the
RS> religious fools out here. No one believes in them. In fact,
RS> Australia is post-Christian.
I might love the USA, and Australia may have a higher cost of living,
but this alone is almost enough to make me consider moving. :)
... And I say north is where I WANT it to be! - Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
---
* TLX v4.00 *Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: Ed Mills
|Sub: paranoid?
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:39
EID:282a 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF Ed = Mills THEN Richard Smith ELSE paranoid?
EM> That was a short-lived career, actually. It was alcohol that
EM> took a while to put down. But I abhor the idea of doing harm to
EM> a human, altered consciousness or not. If a situation arose
EM> wherein there was a choice of shoot or skedaddle, I'd always
EM> take the latter. It's the hardware that's fun to play around
EM> with - macho fantasies aside, the idea of _actually_ having to
EM> use it on someone is really unthinkable. Although the occasional
EM> John Salvi does inspire some carnal thought. :)
On the bright side, should you suddenly need to seperate a pumpkin into
many pieces at once... :)
... "Action Jesus! Manger sold seperately..." -- Crow T. Robot
---
* TLX v4.00 *Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: Steve Quarrella
|Sub: In the news
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:40
EID:0635 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF Steve = Quarrella THEN Rod Swift ELSE In the news
SQ> I'd rather they get it in a drive-by shooting. That way, I don't have
SQ> to pay tax dollars to have them on death row for years. In any event,
SQ> they won't get the death penalty: The First Amendment is misused to
SQ> give THEM the "special rights." If you do something "in the name of
SQ> God," you get off easier. :-/
"In the name of the great and most holy StarGoat, let's smite these
fuckers."
Sorry. Couldn't resist.
---
ž TLX v4.00 ž "If I give myself up, do I get the reward?"
Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: David Worrell
|Sub: Clones vs Clowns
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:40
EID:0566 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF David = Worrell THEN Judith Bandsma ELSE Clones vs Clowns
DW> Heh. I wonder if you can change the sex of a clone? That might be the
DW> best way to find a woman I can get along with. :)
I recall hearing a filksong of sorts using that premise...
Something to the tune of "Home on the Range".
... "Here comes Roasty and Toasty, the firemen clowns!" -- Joel
---
* TLX v4.00 *Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: David Rice
|Sub: Exemplifying examples
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:40
EID:1e37 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF David = Rice THEN Dan Ceppa ELSE Exemplifying examples
DC> And, just why can you only speculate? Where _is_ the
DC> Garden of Eden? Perhaps we should send a scientific
DC> team to it to investigate it.
DR> Ensign Pavlovich Chekov said it was "Just outside Russia."
No doubt some would say it's in Texas. They have everything in Texas.
---
ž TLX v4.00 ž "Go away, you poopy-kaka-head Russians!" -- Crow T. Robot
Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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|From: Damien Wellman
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Cracker Barrel Boycot
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:56:40
EID:fde8 22699f00
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8608
IF Richard = Smith THEN Ed Mills ELSE Cracker Barrel Boycot
RS> I think you've finally found your niche here in the
RS> HOLYSMOKE habitat . . . Weapons Expert and Ammo Advisor.
RS> Maybe you could make it a column or something:
RS> Dear Mr. Gunsmith:
RS> I've been bothered recently by a lot of Jehovah's
RS> Witlesses and Morons on my front porch. I would love
RS> to blow them out of their shoes, but my wife doesn't
RS> want me to spatter the front porch. Can you recommend
RS> a calibre with stopping power that won't make much of
RS> a mess?
RS> -- Concerned in Sacramento
RS> Anyway, you get the point . . .
Heh. "There is no problem that a sufficent concentration of high
explosives will not solve."
---
ž TLX v4.00 ž "You're far too late for your afternoon meds." -- Ceppa
Email: damienw@juno.com
~~~ ReneWave v2.00 [NR]
---
* Origin: The Stargate BBS - (304) 453-6625 - Kenova, WV - (1:262/20)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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|From: Dave Hamilton
|To: Norman Solomon
|Sub: Book Theft
|Date: 09 Mar 97 23:29:16
EID:2736 2269bba0
REPLY: 2:2501/217@fidonet.org 175c697a
MSGID: 1:229/622 332349f7
CHRS: IBMPC 2
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10440
NS> Rom 8 paraphrased (but not to death) For those God foreknew, he
NS> predestined, called, justified then glorified.
Ah, but isn't this Calvanism (without the work-ethic part)?
NS> Many christians stick
NS> sanctified in there but it's not and that's the good news. They are
NS> all things God does which relates to salvation.
So it's not an even playing field?
NS> The gap between
NS> Justification (saved/born again or whatever) and Glorification is our
NS> post saved christian life, where we will work out our salvation
NS> (sanctification). But if you have been justified you will be
NS> glorified. The incomplete sanctification being completed in an
NS> instant as we are rebuilt into the likeness of Christ.
Ok, I follow your thesis here (well, Paul's) but I have always
been unable to buy it. I've worked in counselling situations with
people normally considered complete losers. Crack addicts who
keep falling down and getting up, over and over. They are in so
much shit they won't in their entire lifetimes ever even get
to start following xtian dogma. But they do no harm to anyone
but themselves and are often very loveable people. In the same
community I've met folks who do not have the same self-imposed
obstacles but are very difficult to like. The difference can
be found in the gospels, not in the epistles.
--- FleetStreet 1.18+
* Origin: Aurora Exploratoria, Newcastle, ON, Canada (1:229/622)
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|From: Dave Hamilton
|To: Fredric Rice
|Sub: Drugs
|Date: 09 Mar 97 23:55:10
EID:50db 2269bee0
REPLY: 1:218/890@FidoNet 2187ef48
MSGID: 1:229/622 332350a8
CHRS: IBMPC 2
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10440
dh>> From personal observation I would put the drug
dh>> folks at about 20%....
FR> What year was this? I'm going by 1995 statistics.
FR> Offense Percentage
FR> Drugs 60.5
FR> Robbery 9.9
FR> Firearms, Explosives, Arson 9.5
[...]
This would have been 1989. The day after I posted this, I
watched a CBC documentary on prison populations around the
world. It professed that the US drug offenders percentage
is magnitudes higher than anywhere else in the world. This
could simply be a reflection of the laws themselves. Here,
you have to traffic bigtime to get into trouble with drugs,
but you can do time for posessing an unregistered firearm.
I have a federal record for discharging a firearm within
a populated municipality. When I was twelve, I was caught
shooting an air powered pellet gun in a forest that was
legally inside city limits. I got a suspended sentence
because of my age. A twelve-year-old today caught with
pockets full of cocaine would not be charged.
FR>> And of these more than 5 million
FR>> people, nearly 100% of them are Christian.
dh>> I guess, if the sample method is self-report. It pays to profess
dh>> xtianity in court.
FR> Yes, that's quite true. It does help. And yet there is no other way
FR> to determine whether someone is a Christian or not than to ask.
I would agree with that. What that person does is simply what
one xtian does.
FR> One of the prison officials who answered some of my questions made
FR> that comment as well. He told me that people on the inside adopt
FR> Christianity when it pays to appear pious yet many of them are
FR> actually Muslims.
I keep forgetting about black people. We have a very small
Muslim population mostly from North Africa and the Middle East.
Our black population is quite small, and most of them who are
religious would be Christian.
--- FleetStreet 1.18+
* Origin: Aurora Exploratoria, Newcastle, ON, Canada (1:229/622)
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: All
|Sub: My Bear and Computers
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:9eed 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org a8a10046
My beloved has done it again--he's killed the hard drive on my computer.
While I can switch over to the old system until the pent comes back from
the shop, I've lost any mail packets that I had waiting, and any answers
I had ready to upload. If you sent something to me, and haven't
received a reply in a reasonable length of time, please resend it to
me--either here or to katherine.wintersnight@cantina.com.
Now, if one of you who know something about computers could just explain
to me how that man can destroy a good system installing Norton
Utilities, I would appreciate it. As it is, I'm just trying to stay
calm, and remind myself that the occasional computer is a small price to
pay for a man so wonderful in so many other ways.
(Score to date since Jan 1--the pent three times, the 486 twice, and his
mother's elderly 286 once)
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * I know it all. I just can't remember it all at once.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Shelby Sherman
|Sub: 7 The List
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:9a08 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org eb01c14d
SS>02 Mar 97 11:13, quoting Katherine Wintersnight to All:
SS> KW> *David Worrell, TN Small Dicked Too
long
SS> KW> for aka Azirafel Misogynist (tm)
SS> KW> other's comfort
SS> KW> -about
SS>At least you made the list, you needle-dicked woman hater.
You I didn't have enough info on to guess about. Where are you, what
are you, and how long have you been hanging around here?
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * I used to have a handle on life, then it broke.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: .
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:1dad 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org a3a5f152
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Judith Bandsma said to Richard Smith about .:
RS> RS> seem there was a concensus, unless I have to run it up the
RS> RS> crucifix and see who genuflects for the harpy-wannabees?
RS> JB> Harpies don't want the groveling/genuflecting routine...what
RS> JB> we want is to see abject terror.
RS> Ah, just like any other boss I ever had . . .
All we want is our proper due of respect. And we get it, one way or the
other.
RS> JB> It was priceless. Shall we put you on staff as freelance
RS> RS> Tres cool. Yes, certainly. Though, I must inform you,
RS> RS> I cannot take some of my wages in trade . . .
RS> JB> The operative word in that sentence was FREElance.
RS> Well, okay then.
However, you may well want to take out some of that FREElance in
pies. Or, is there truly no one in your life that deserves a heaping
helping of Harpy Pie?
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * I'm still waiting for sound logical reasoning.Got any?-RC
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Cheese Whiz
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:cf82 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org fc2a5d83
JS> LB> You have received my documented post explaining that you are incorrect
JS> LB> and Marilyn is exactly right by now, i trust.
JS> LB> Jim...do you understand what the cervix IS?
JS>Uh...that which covers the opening to the womb? (heesh. I ain't no
JS>OBGYN, ya know)
Jimmy, ask Wilber to introduce you to her cervix. It
doesn't cover the opening to the uterus (womb), it is a ring of muscle
that is the lower portion of the uterus. 'Birth canal' is a colloquial
term for the vagina (as you are married and a father, I am assuming that
you have at least a passing notion of what and where the vagina is).
The cervix projects into the vagina. Ask Wilber to allow you to insert
a clean finger gently into her vagina and feel carefully up to the very
top. Toward the back you will find a rubbery projection--that
is the cervix. There is a small hole in the tip of it--that is called
the os, and is the entrance into the uterus. Most of the month it is
blocked with a plug of mucus so it doesn't need a cover. Do you
understand now, or do you need illustrations?
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * If this were an actual tagline, it would be funny.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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SEEN-BY: 270/101 275/429 280/1 169 282/1 62 283/120 284/29 290/14 300/603
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Judith Bandsma
|Sub: Theft & Catholicism
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:c2d3 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 7af87d79
JB>-=> Charles complained of warm pie, cold coffee, and no paper to Katherine
<=-
JB> CC> There you will have NO friends. I am your friend, because I am
JB> CC> concerned for your soul.
JB> CC> ! Origin: The Cat House BBS - Greer, SC (FIDONET 1:3639/88)
JB> ^^^^^^^^^
JB>Assholes like this, here in SC, are getting Holysmoke but I'm not. I'm
JB>pissed.
There, there, Judith, at least you don't have to deal with a Bear
totalling your computer. . .
JB>How's the pup getting along?
Soot's doing great. Thank you for the advice--it's already having
marked effects on his behaviour.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Ignorance is bliss, but it will never replace sex.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
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SEEN-BY: 310/666 322/739 323/107 324/278 343/600 346/250 352/3 356/18 369/32
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Ronald Vass
|Sub: Profanity 01/
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:01ef 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 8bc1b3bb
RV>=======
RV>>>KW>Honeybunch, it's usually the woman who gets left hanging. Anyway,
I'm
RV>>RV>Right. I've heard that statement from some women.
RV>KW>And you admit it???!??
RV>Why lie, as a male, I know, i'm not perfect all the time.
I'm going to give you the benefit of doubt, and assume that you do go on
to remedy the situation.
RV>======
RV>KW>RV>Perhaps you should find a male to set it up for you. [ dam if that
RV>KW>RV>doesn't get a pie, nothing will ]
RV>KW>It wouldn't have, as a male did set up the BBS, and most of my troubles
RV>KW>with my home system are caused by another male's habit of creatively
RV>KW>killing the computer.
RV>Yes i know. Sounds like my hub. When it starts working as it should.
RV>He just has to play around, then it's screwup again for a few weeks.
RV>
Will bought the board from another gentleman about a year ago--and he's
still learning the software. And, being male, he's had to play with it
.
RV>KW>The problem does seem to be with La Cantina--as I haven't had this
RV>KW>problem with other BBSs. Will is a sweet dear man, who is almost
as
RV>KW>talented as Bear at finding 'new' ways to get the computer to do things.
RV>Does he know, which end of a screw-driver, to use ?
Bear just killed my pent again. I'm falling back on the old computer,
and trying hard not to find new uses for that screw-driver.
RV>=======
RV>KW>RV>Yup. I agree, the kitchen is a danger area for women, then to
RV>KW>RV>it's a danger for males, also. Mistress J. is copying my bad habits.
RV>KW>RV>Meals left uncooked and dishs unwash.
RV>KW>Sounds like you need to get to work. Bear and I have a very simple
RV>KW>agreement--I cook, he cleans up afterwards. Of course, he does get
RV>KW>upset when I get into a french mood and dirty every single pot and
bowl
RV>KW>in the kitchen turning out a simple little veal stew. On the other
RV>KW>hand, he's been offered upwards of $20 for a plate of leftovers at
work,
RV>KW>and turned it down.
RV>If i cook, Joyce does the dishs. If she cooks, i do them. Usually
RV>i end up doing them in any case, old habits from home, learned as
RV>a kid. Joyce can ignore the mess longer then I can.
RV>=====
I've taught Bear to do some basic cooking--at least I don't have to
worry that he'll starve if I get sick again .
RV>>RV>not here, i lose out. ie: any ill effects happening, you will
RV>>RV>have a women hunting you down. Down though the ages of time,
RV>>RV>I've learn one thing. NEVER, NEVER every get a women mad at you.
RV>KW>Sounds like it's time to send 'you' a chocolate raspberry pound cake.
RV>KW>I'm sure she'll tell you about it. . .
RV>KW>RV>There is no meaner creature.
RV>KW>
RV>And I don't feel sorry for any male, who never learns that lesson.
RV>I seen [MALE] males, pull some nasty stunts on the X-whatever, then
RV>a period of time down the road. I heard the results of later war action
RV>by the female. Usually in the long run, the short term fun isn't worth
RV>the long term pain. [ thinking of a certain asshole i know of and
RV>getting a smile from a womens attack ]
RV>More power to her. . .
So mote it be !
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * In the end, the love you take is equal to the love you
make.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Quentin Fai
|Sub: Re: HELLO
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:e1a2 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org bc466720
QF> LB> TELLING TO THE GENEREATION TO COME THE PRAISES OF THE LORD.
QF>It's kinda hard to get semen to spell words. Ever try it?
I just hafta ask--how much time do you send practising that?
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Jesse Helms' ulitmate nightmare: gay tobacco farmers
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: 6 The List
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:afe8 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 32f23cc2
DC>-> On 02 Mar 97 06:13:00, Katherine Wintersnight got back to All
DC> KW> *Preston G. Memphis, TN militant agnostic ????
DC> KW> Simpson
DC>Please insert somehere in there that Preston _is_ the
DC>God of Twinkies!
Done.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Jesus saves, and televangelists own the bank.
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Charles Creager
|Sub: THEFT & CATHOLICIS
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:6d70 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 121640c0
As the original of your message was one of the victims of my dear
Bear's experiment n computer programing, and as I do very much want to
address the points that you brought up I will be answering those points
as I see them quoted in other's replies to you post.
RH> -=> Quoting Charles Creager to Katherine Wintersnight <=-
RH> CC> Dear Katherine,
RH> CC> I do not know whether you or someone else is the originator of the
RH> CC> following quote, but I found it on your message.
RH> KW> * OLXWin 1.00a * "God is an asshole"--MB
Those taglines that I've clipped out of other people's posts I so
indicate by placing the initials of the person quoted after the tagline.
MB would most likely be Marilyn Burge. I wouldn't not have clipped it
and put it into my tagline file unless I found that I either agreed with
it, or found it amusing. In this case, I agreed with it.
RH> CC> I really feel sorry for the person or persons that speak of God
in
RH> CC> that manner. I feel sorry for them because they will have to answer
RH> CC> to that God.
I'm not worried about answering to your god. First, because I feel that
**if** he does exist as described (a subject that I have strong
reservations about) I do strongly feel that he himself has entirely to
much to answer for to ever be able to judge me. I find your god to be
morally deficient. I find his followers to be, on the whole, fools and
sheep, and totally deserving of the pain and anguish that they have
brought upon themselves. And I can not think of a more horrid fate than
to be confined at the feet of that nasty and immoral god for all of
eternity, forced to mouth 'praises' to a deity that I despise.
Of course, there is always the chance that if he does exist, he is not
as he's portrayed by the xtians. Then, if that should be proven to be
so, I will give him a chance to explain himself.
RH> CC> you haven't (and I question whether you have based on what I have
read
RH> CC> that YOU have written), then you are headed for a Godless
RH> CC> enternity. Don't say that you will have many friends there. There
RH> CC> you will have NO friends. I am your friend, because I am concerned
RH> CC> for your soul.
Oh, I'm not 'godless', I just don't have your god. Nor, do I want him.
And those that I consider friends don't come to my door with a smarmy
smile on their face and foul threats in there mouth. Your pride has
gotten the better of you, Charles. Your attempts to intimidate are
transparent, and only bring me to a lower opinion of your god and your
faith. Keep your bloodstained fingers off of my soul. It's not for
sacrifice to your god.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Lottery: A tax on people who are bad at math.
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Richard Smith
|Sub: Dork
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:e9c9 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 809f9975
RS> RIP Verna Mae Russell 1911-96
RS> Katherine Wintersnight said to Lynda Bustilloz about Dork:
RS> DR> You know me not, woman. And yet you speak of
RS> dr> assumptions. Cute.
RS> LB> I only know you by your words. :) Why post what you
RS> LB> don't mean and then get testy if people with you
RS> LB> accordingly?
RS> LB> Oh, and congratulations for FINALLY actually calling
RS> LB> someone a woman who IS one. That makes 1 out of 3. If
RS> LB> you get better at it you may yet get that sex life you
RS> LB> lack.
RS> KW> It does make you wonder about just what it is that
RS> KW> he's married to.
RS> Are we talking Wilbur Complex here?
Well, the descriptions that these fundies tend to give of their partners
are, well, colorful at the least and down right scary in many cases.
We've got one married to a Wilber, another who's married to a blow up
doll, and the occasional Maria Russell wandering through to remind us
that such oddities do really exist.
But for all of their 'xtianity', they also can't seem to resist
following Lynda around begging her to spank them. . .much to Lynda's
bemusement.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Mental Floss prevents Moral Decay.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Marilyn Burge
|Sub: Hypocritical people
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:1fdb 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org d695c507
MB>On (06 Mar 97) Katherine Wintersnight babbled to Marilyn Burge...
DC> KY> Brine a fundy
DC> RS> Eeeewwww, born again gerkins . . .
DC> DC> Close: The correct spelling is 'jerk-ins'.
DC> MB> You're both wrong. It's "gherkins."
KW> DC> Go ahead, Marilyn, ruin a perfectly good pun thread by MB> KW>
KW> DC> insisting on proper spelling. That isn't Kosher, my
MB> KW> dill.
KW> DC>You'll find you are really in a pickle, now.
MB> KW> That's how she makes her bread and butter.
KW> MB>And without it, I'd be in the soup.
MB> KW> You'd relish that.
KW> MB>You're right; it's just my cup 'o tea.
MB> KW> As long as you don't earn the scone of your neighbors.
MB>Well, now, just don't you stew about it.
How else to brew up some fun in here?
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Milkman in high heels - Dairy Queen
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Steve Quarrella
|Sub: Theft & Catholicism
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:fdbf 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 8c2f3a0d
SQ>Salue, Katherine!
SQ>Saturni dies March 01 1997, Dixit Charles Creager ad Katherine Wintersnight:
SQ> CC> I do not know whether you or someone else is the originator of the
SQ> CC> following quote, but I found it on your message.
SQ> KW>> * OLXWin 1.00a * "God is an asshole"--MB
SQ> CC> I really feel sorry for the person or persons that speak of God
in that
SQ> CC> manner. I feel sorry for them because they will have to answer
to that
SQ>Quick, Katherine! Reel him in before he goes under the boat!
Taglines do provide the best fundy bait, don't they? The arrogance
and pride that is their cornerstone makes a provocative tagline totally
irresistible.
SQ> CC> provided through His Son, Jesus Christ (Cf. Hebrews 2:3). Whether
or not
SQ> CC> you have done so, I do not know, but if you haven't (and I question
SQ> CC> whether you have based on what I have read that YOU have written),
then
SQ> CC> you are headed for a Godless enternity. Don't say that you will
have
SQ>many CC> friends there. There you will have NO friends. I am your friend,
SQ>because CC> I am concerned for your soul.
SQ>Gee whiz, that's great. That's the first time I've heard that....
You will notice that he never mentions that he expects to get salvation
points for bringing another mind to be sacrificed on his gods altar.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * My life has a superb cast but I can't figure out the plot.
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Fat People
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:965a 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 7b01b4c4
RS>KW> RS>Yep yep yep yep *nodnod* I agree! :) I loved the way I had him
RS>KW> RS>on the run about his "oh so powerful God" and then he was turning
RS>KW> RS>around and telling me I should have done something to help
RS>KW> RS>Gwenny! What a hoot!
RS>KW> Well, he somehow managed to give the impression that his 'god' was
about
RS>KW> as powerful as a not yet born man. And that was the only part
of
RS>KW> the issue that he was able to even face to address.
RS>:) :) :) I wonder who that 20+ year unborn person was :) :) :)
RS>And why is that mortal more powerful and has done MORE for Gwenny
RS>babe than his god? :) :) :)
Your actions do seem to be somewhat more effective than his god's.
RS>KW> RS>Oh, I think he makes people think that. Then he plays heavy
RS>KW> RS>until he realises he's made himself look like a fool. Then he
RS>KW> RS>takes a powder.
RS>KW> KW> Last night he was getting horridly offended at a link on my
RS>KW> KW> page, one to
RS>KW> KW> a site that lists christian atrocities. he thought it was terribly
RS>KW> KW> unfair that such lists exist--after all, all those xtians weren't
real
RS>KW> KW> true xtians.
RS>KW> RS>He should pop by and see some of MY links :)
RS>KW> RS>There's some riotously funny links among them :) :)
RS>KW> RS>Did you show him http://www.christiangallery.com/ by any chance?
RS>KW> Oh, he's stomped out after getting his weeny little feelings hurt--Lynda
RS>KW> won't paddle him.
RS>... or dominate him in other ways. Then again, he normally pines
RS>for me at that point, no? :) :) :)
Steiny's gone now. He shook the dust after he found out that Lynda
wasn't for sale.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * My skin, my bones, my heretic heart is my authority
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Warring Christanic Fa
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:9eba 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 1acf2ddd
RS>KW> KW> Oh, Bear can hold the screwdriver. He can even use it with relative
RS>KW> KW> safety to everything but the item he's putting a screw into.
But he's
RS>KW> KW> guaranteed to get at least one part on backwards or upside down.
RS>KW> RS>I remember the tape drive incident :)
RS>KW> Welllll...Ron Vass says I should let a man do it.
RS>Hahahahahaha. :)
Don't laugh, he's worked over the pent again. I'm about to get to work
on a sugar free version of the Harpy Pie for the next time he gets near
a computer with a screwdriver or a CD.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Never stick a high priestess in the ass with an atheme.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Promisekritters
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:60ae 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org d8bd522c
RS>KW> I know where they meet locally, but to tell the truth
I
RS>KW> don't want to have anything to do with them. The local churches
have
RS>KW> come to know me just sell enough to mostly stay away from my front
door.
RS>Well, this is an important factor to consider, yes...
That the locals won't let me get near them? It just shows me how strong
their faith really is.
RS>KW> And I don't think that a PK type is any more capable of learning
than a
RS>KW> pig is of singing.
RS>Oh my, you've demolished my hopes and dreams of destroying their
RS>movement :) :)
Ron, it's their choice and their demonstrated stupidity--at at least
this way they're above ground where I can keep an eye on them.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Omnipotence isn't all it's cracked up to be, I suppose-JM
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Rod Swift
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:2f02 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 8a7f2c18
Okay, now calm down. I don't disagree with you, in the most part.
RS>However, unfortunately, we are the minority. We cannot overcome
RS>this oppression without allies who have fought this battle
RS>before. For now, no one but women will join the gay and lesbian
RS>movement as an ally. That is because women have not received
RS>full equality under the law either.
This is what I disagree with, being married to a straight man who is
fully willing to stand with his (and my) gay friends on this matter.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * On average, people are mean.
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Karen Davis
|Sub: Dork
|Date: 08 Mar 97 14:32:00
EID:6312 22687400
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org b26a4b28
KD>On (26 Feb 97) Lynda Bustilloz wrote to DAVID RAGLAND...
KD> LB> I was just the other night deploring how long it had been since
a
KD> LB> Holysmoke whacko had graced me with a new nickname.
KD>Sniff Sniff.... nobody has given me one. Have I been too quiet in here?
Be patient, it takes time. The only ones that I've been given are
wither as part of a group deal, or as part of an experiment on the
sexual suggestiveness of nicks with a 'cat' motif.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Pardon me, but are reason and logic allowed here?
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Lynda Bustilloz
|Sub: return
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:58:00
EID:3d69 22696f40
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 052eb847
LB>Lynda and Katherine were killing time yakking about return:
LB> LB>I think Michael would find it much safer in the kitchen where he
could
LB>keep LB>a close eye on what ingredients go into what. However he MUST
promise
LB>to KW> keep
LB> LB>the coffee mugs filled, and not to listen too closely to the gossip.
LB> KW> And not to do that goggle eyed thing. I hate it when he does that.
LB>Well, when a manic cat is gouging into your leg, it's pretty hard to
keep
LB>your eyes from bugging out!
It is his duty to refrain from making strange faces or odd noises, to
continue to scratch my ears, and to not interrupt the conversation, no
matter where I should choose to sharpen my claws.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.-Samuel Johnson
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Dan Ceppa
|Sub: Hypocritical people
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:58:00
EID:3b37 22696f40
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org bcac5f08
DC>-> On 04 Mar 97 15:50:00, Katherine Wintersnight got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> DC> DC> KY> Brine a fundy
DC> DC> DC> RS> Eeeewwww, born again gerkins . . .
DC> DC> DC> DC> Close: The correct spelling is 'jerk-ins'.
DC> DC> DC> MB> You're both wrong. It's "gherkins."
DC> DC> DC>Go ahead, Marilyn, ruin a perfectly good pun thread by
DC> DC> DC>insisting on proper spelling. That isn't Kosher, my dill.
DC> DC> DC>You'll find you are really in a pickle, now.
DC> DC> KW> That's how she makes her bread and butter.
DC> DC>She could always bring home the pigs' feet instead.
DC> KW> I hadn't thought about that aspic.
DC>And, having done that, it all jelled together, I'm sure.
It still depends on who has the mousse evidence.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Preacher-salaried, urban witch doctor
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Ken Wiens
|Sub: alignment list.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:58:00
EID:7b1f 22696f40
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 44a6da8d
KW>KW>Please address additions to the list to me, under the subject
KW>KW>"alignment list". I've started adding the people who
KW>KW>haven't given me their own entry--so unless you want to risk
KW>KW>my best guess of what you are, best let me know.
KW>KW>If I've added you and you want it changed, just give me the
KW>KW>corrected material--and I will quote it exactly as you give it .
KW> It seems to be quite a complete list. However, my last name was
KW> spelled wrong. It is "Wiens", not "Weins." It is a common
KW> misspelling. Ok, I'll go back and hide under my bed now.
KW> Thank You.
The correction is done.
KW> p.s. My alias is Jim Goodman...Don't tell Richard Smith,
KW> though. I think he already knows. :) I like irritating
KW> that boy. He is so easily irritable.
This information has been inserted--you can view the list at it's
permanent home at http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3158/cat.html
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere may
be hap
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
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|From: Katherine Wintersnight
|To: Ronald Vass
|Sub: 8 The List
|Date: 09 Mar 97 13:58:00
EID:5ea1 22696f40
MSGID: 1:381/123@fidonet.org 0cc9e00e
RV>KW>This list may also be found on my web page--
RV>KW>http://www.geocities.com/Athens/3158/cast.html
RV>One to eight.1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8. Made it to Brantford,Ont.
---
* OLXWin 1.00a * Reality is intuitive
--- QScan/PCB v1.19b / 01-0093
* Origin: La Cantina BBS * El Paso * 915-532-0332 * 4 Nodes (1:381/123)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Cracker Barrel boycott
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:31:49
EID:aa86 226973e0
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322c9ee
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 331b608a
PID: GED3 2.5
03 Mar 97 18:36, Ken Young wrote to Fredric Rice:
FR>> few are Muslim, Buddhists, or Jewish. There are no atheist hate
FR>> groups.
KY> No? Just by a group being an atheist group, generally means it is a
KY> hate group. Don't they generally hate Christianity?
You, like most of your brethren, seem to have "contempt" confused with "hate."
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Driving Mr. Daisy
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:32:40
EID:da57 22697400
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322ca20
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 331b8c8a
PID: GED3 2.5
03 Mar 97 21:44, Ken Young wrote to Steve Quarrella:
KY> A little kissing or whatever would be fine, but it is another thing
to
KY> make a point of telling the whole world all about your sexual
KY> preference. If it is none of my concern, then don;t make it my
KY> concern.
Then why are you here letting the whole world know about your sexual preference?
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Found Christians on the Web
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:40:37
EID:1eff 22697500
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322cbfd
REPLY: 1:270/420.0 331c98c6
PID: GED3 2.5
04 Mar 97 16:48, Ken Young wrote to Fredric Rice:
FR>> To all Christians: These racists bigots are what your
FR>> death cult is all about.
KY> Hmm.. How do so many non-Christians know so much about Christianity?
KY> Answer: You don't. Otherwise, you would realize that hatred would be
KY> going against Christian beliefs.
Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother,
and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life
also, he cannot be my disciple.
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: infinitesimals
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:51:27
EID:27d5 22697660
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322ce94
REPLY: 1:100/435.1 685823a2
PID: GED3 2.5
06 Mar 97 21:20, John Brawley wrote to Lynda Bustilloz:
JB> A dimensionless point is still a THING.
And therein lies your entire problem.
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: 'First Cause' Crap
|Date: 09 Mar 97 15:00:54
EID:c187 22697800
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322d372
REPLY: 1:100/435.1 100fe7cb
PID: GED3 2.5
03 Mar 97 09:48, John Brawley wrote to David Worrell:
DW>> And *any* distance greater than zero, when dealing with the
DW>> "coalescence" of dimensionless points, might as well be several
DW>> parsecs.
JB> Perceptive of you.
JB> Now find a way to _phrase_that_ in some standard math format.
dmin=0+
DW>> What part of "dimensionless" are you having trouble
DW>> understanding?
JB> I ain't _me_ having that trouble, obviously.
"IS NOT!" again, John? I see you've been hanging around Appleton too long.
JB>> geotopological, that he said he was too busy to discuss.
DW>> I'm sure it was, John.
JB> Oh, I strongly doubt _that_.
JB> His letters to me are in _my_ files, not in yours.
I'm sure they are, John.
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: David Worrell
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: infinitesimals
|Date: 09 Mar 97 15:12:49
EID:27d5 22697980
MSGID: 1:123/67.7 3322d39c
REPLY: 1:100/435.1 e8a2e25f
PID: GED3 2.5
03 Mar 97 09:58, John Brawley wrote to David Worrell:
DW>> Thanks for allowing me to take credit for another flyby.
JB> You missed the concept in the first place. A dimensionless point is
a
JB> 'thing' --a nonzero item.
No, John. It is a concept. Thanks for playing, though.
---
* Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop, No. 7 (1:123/67.7)
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|From: Dave Hamilton
|To: Fredric Rice
|Sub: Drugs
|Date: 10 Mar 97 12:52:00
EID:252f 226a6680
MSGID: 1:229/622 0044d6e8
REPLY: 1:218/890@FidoNet 2187ef48
PID: SemPoint 2.25 UNREG
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 10440
On , you wrote:
FR> What year was this? I'm going by 1995 statistics.
FR> Offense Percentage
FR> Drugs 60.5
FR> Robbery 9.9
FR> Firearms, Explosives, Arson 9.5
FR> Extortion, Fraud, Bribery 6.1
FR> Property Offenses 5.3
FR> Immigration 2.1
FR> Continuing Criminal Enterprise 0.8
FR> White Collar 0.8
FR> Courts of Corrections 0.8
FR> National Security 0.1
FR> Miscellaneous 1.5
FR> This was pulled straight from a "Justice" Department's web pages.
I did some scrounging and found this for the Canadian Services for Correction.
This
is for 1996.
Offence Pct Number
Homicide 20.1 4,553
Sex 17.9 4,041
Robbery 32.8 7,418
Drug 24.8 5,615
This is unfortunately as detailed as it gets, but as you can see, I wasn't
too far off in my guess of 20%. There are detailed reports that result in
this summary, but I could not determine where a subject would fit if
he were charged with both robbery and drug trafficing (not an impossible
situation).
---
* Origin: ... day++; dollar--; Sigh(); (1:229/622)
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|From: John Brawley
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: FREE WILL
|Date: 07 Mar 97 18:06:09
EID:0707 226790c0
MSGID: 1:100/435.1 0d0198a9
On 03 Mar 97, Roger Hunter wrote:
RH> None, because nonlocality cannot be used to transmit information.
JB> You're confusing a) human-meaningful "information" with a natural
JB> configurational effect, b) "information" with the wholism of "the
RH> Doesn't matter. No information can be made to appear that way
RH> either. It's specifically forbidden by "those who know".
(*grin*) That's _just_ what I need: more from "those who know."
New book recommended: David Wick: _The_Infamous_Boundary_. A much
better book than the usual, on quantum mechanics and its problems. Very
understandable, albeit right up near my limits-to-understanding. NOT a
book in which I really wanted to read subtle things wrong with
experimental EPR checks on Bell's inequality....
JB> particles, yet it's experimentally obvious that doing something to
one
JB> of them produces an unambiguous effect in both of them.
RH> Agreed. But that effect cannot be used to transmit information.
Again, "define 'information'." Obviously something 'exists' between the
two particles, and just as obviously, something's done to only one of
them. The existence of the effect itself is a sort of "information."
JB> what we would call "intelligent," or "serially transmitted"
JB> information.
RH> I agree that the effect is observed and it would seem to me that it
RH> could be used to transmit information. But I know that I do not
RH> understand this business and I suspect that you do not either. But
RH> those who DO (or should) understand it say you are wrong.
I understand what prevents "intelligible" information from being
transmitted by it, and I understand that it's only a human-style concept
that makes it seem like one particle is "informing" the other about its
state --even if the "informing" process is instantaneous. I just
reserve judgment about what sort of _collective_effect_ may or may not
be possible over great distances and using vast numbers of geometrically
configured ERP pairs. (For example, extending the effect, all the
photons that leave the surface of a star at the same instant (a
spherical shell, or wavefront, of photons) should be to some degree
'entangled' (correlated). That would mean that any of them, interacting
with something far away, should change the rest of them a bit. Like
billions and billions of spherically-"transmissive" (I know... I
know....) contacts, billions and billions of stars in some configuration
may constitute a complex pattern of EPR effects, each back-propagating
with the others. It's not "information" as we'd think of it, but it is
an interaction, and a complex one.
JB> Likewise, it might be said that neurons, any single one of which does
JB> not carry anything _nearly_ as complex as "intelligent" information,
JB> yet _somehow_ manages to produce --IN ASSOCIATION with billion of
JB> others-- that wonderful thing we call self-aware and intelligent
JB> information- processing.
RH> And that's the real mystery. Why is the global phone network not
RH> self-aware? How can awareness arise out of an interconnected network
RH> passing electrochemical impulses around?
"Trillions" of cells in the brain, for one thing; more by far than the
nodes in the phone systems; some specific patterns of layout, for
another. We're just beginning to grasp "how" the brain is laid out, and
haven't yet begun to determine how its layout results in self-awareness.
To me, a "feedback loop" image is the simplest explanation, and we
already know parts of the brain back-propagate to other parts, which
when triggered, back-propagate _back_. (et cetera ad moritoriam (until
it dies).) There are electrical 'standing waves' of specific and
constant frequency (alpha, beta, delta, theta 'rhythms'). We know that.
If these are feedback loops, I see no reason why the universe's
nonlocality, distributed in strings and drifts like streams, could not
feed back on themselves similarly....
JB> The effect seems to be solely that of a _configuration_ with 'delay
JB> lines' in time. We have a wetware organ made of parallel-processing
JB> subunits (neurons), each of which can only fire or not fire, whose
JB> sole difference from a pile of them is its specific _configuration_.
RH> Wrong.
"Wrong?" Wrong _what_?
Jno B. : jbrawley@creation.org (GenesisNet<-->Internet Gate)
: jbrawley@jcn1.com (ISP account)
: FidoNet: 1:100/435.1 GenNet 33:6250/1.1
* Origins Talk BBS / M.A.C., St. Louis, MO, (314) 821 1078 *
... WARNING! Evolution may be hazardous to your Ego.
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: The Quantum Sword (1:100/435.1)
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|From: John Brawley
|To: Fredric Rice
|Sub: Quantum crackpot brawley
|Date: 07 Mar 97 18:26:59
EID:2348 22679340
MSGID: 1:100/435.1 357efa46
REPLY: 1:218/890@FidoNet 1f938c59
On 04 Mar 97, Fredric Rice wrote:
FR> Even though Skeptic Magazine covered Quantum Quackery and these nut's
FR> delusions, both would, I opine, not be able to see themselves being
FR> discussed.
FR> This particular magazine issue is a good one because it gives just a
FR> bit of the physics behind the religious beliefs then _briefly_
FR> explains why the but is mistaken.
Having now read it, I see that you'd be far better advised to do your
own judging, from books like David Wick's _The_Infamous_Boundary_.
The SkepInq author is apprantly as ignorant of actual quantum mechanics
as y'all are....
Jno B. : jbrawley@creation.org (GenesisNet<-->Internet Gate)
: jbrawley@jcn1.com (ISP account)
: FidoNet: 1:100/435.1 GenNet 33:6250/1.1
* Origins Talk BBS / M.A.C., St. Louis, MO, (314) 821 1078 *
... "I am Superconductor of Borg; resistance is futile."
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: The Quantum Sword (1:100/435.1)
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|From: John Brawley
|To: Roger Hunter
|Sub: TRY 1
|Date: 07 Mar 97 18:29:43
EID:2565 226793a0
MSGID: 1:100/435.1 2642f05a
On 05 Mar 97, Roger Hunter wrote:
-=> Quoting John Brawley to Robert Curry <=-
JB> In this visual, continuousness only partially applies. The newtwork
JB> of points is inherently discrete. The distance between pairs of point
JB> is continuous. The concept Tetrahedraverse is both --it blends the
JB> two systems, but keeps them separated. Axiomatically-structurally,
RH> And this is the source of your problem, I would guess. Mathematics
RH> is more consistent. A space is discrete OR continuous, not both.
I don't think so. The construct contains both, but they are kept
separate in a sense. You should see that. You know the range
[(dmin),2#(dmin)] is continuous between (dmin) _through_ 2*(dmin) (it
would go to arbitrary distance were it not for the compressed manifold
and the SNAP!s), and the SNAP!s are as discrete as the points themselves
are. So, how is this NOT a possible space BOTH discrete (points;
SNAP!s) AND continuous ([(dmin),2*(dmin)] ?
RH> For example l0 and l1 spaces. In l0, all lines are at right angles,
RH> like a sheet of graph paper. In that space, you CANNOT speak of a
RH> diagonal line. The Pythagorean theorem is false (there). Square
RH> circles are possible. 7-sided triangles are possible, etc.
RH> In our l1 space, the reverse is true. You CANNOT have a square circle
RH> or a 7-sided triangle.
Uh.... you're beyond me with that; I don't know the notation you're
using....
RH> Now in T-Verse, dmin is the smallest possible distance but the
RH> space inside a true Icosa is smaller than dmin (measured surface
RH> to surface, not center to center) and this is paradoxical, an
RH> internal axiom violation.
(?) What? That stuff inside the true icosa is in the range [(dmin),
2*(dmin)], is it not? How's that forbidden, when it exists all over the
place in p-to-p sets (roughly half of 'em, in a 'fully-stretched'
icosahedronot)? That is, why do you see any difference between the
unremovable, unclosable > (dmin), < 2*(dmin) gaps in some of the the I-
(not)'s outer 12 p-to-ps, and the same things inside the true icosa?
They're just the same thing; but between opposite-side pairs....
RH> Hey, STEVE GUNHOUSE or ROBERT CURRY, did I screw this up or not?
As above explained, If you think you found a paradox _there_, you
screwed it up. The _paradox_ is all in the meaning of (dmin), far as I
can tell. Two opposite pionts in a true icosa have the same sort of gap
in the distance between them as two neighbor pionts among the outer 12,
far as I can see. What's the difference?
Jno B. : jbrawley@creation.org (GenesisNet<-->Internet Gate)
: jbrawley@jcn1.com (ISP account)
: FidoNet: 1:100/435.1 GenNet 33:6250/1.1
* Origins Talk BBS / M.A.C., St. Louis, MO, (314) 821 1078 *
... When all think alike, then no one is thinking.
--- PPoint 2.00
* Origin: The Quantum Sword (1:100/435.1)
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|From: RIC CARTER
|To: DAVID WORRELL
|Sub: BIBLE QUOTES
|Date: 10 Mar 97 02:52:32
EID:a5fb 226a1680
TID: PX/Win v2.0GY PX96-0455M
MSGID: 1:2002/2002 6594165b
-=> Quoting David Worrell to Ric Carter <=-
DW> 03 Mar 97 12:32, RIC CARTER wrote to JUDITH BANDSMA:
RC> I'm not sure that "gay", as used now, would be meaningful in
RC> the Levant 2 millennia ago - but, polymorphous perversity has
RC> been around a *long* time, and Jeshua *may*, at various times
RC> in his life, have been sexually active with boys, men, girls,
RC> women, sheep, goats, camels, burros, aliens and conservatives.
DW> I *seriously* doubt that even Jesus would stoop to conservatives.
Maybe they forced him. Drugged him, raped him, tickled him.
Maybe they coerced him. Threats, bribes, his own condo w/HBO.
Maybe they mind-zapped him. Conservatives do that, y'know.
That's how they propagate their disfunctional meme: hypnosis.
DW> (You were expecting something like this, weren't you?)
Damn, I've been discovered. Now I gotta change my fingerprints.
... "Bother" said Pooh, as he reported Huey, Dewey & Louie for vandalism.
___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30 [NR]
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/Wildcat5! v2.0GY
* Origin: Pacific Online Services ISP/BBS (707.588.0250) www.pon.net (1:2002/2002)
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|From: RIC CARTER
|To: DAVID WORRELL
|Sub: For the Mooth Booth
|Date: 10 Mar 97 02:52:32
EID:b84c 226a1680
TID: PX/Win v2.0GY PX96-0455M
MSGID: 1:2002/2002 8bfe0398
-=> Quoting David Worrell to Ric Carter <=-
DW> 03 Mar 97 12:32, RIC CARTER wrote to LYNDA BUSTILLOZ:
RC> "For your sake we are being killed all day long; we are accounted
RC> as sheep to be slaughtered." [Rom.8:36]
RC> Here, g0D directs that Xians shall be slaughtered like sheep.
RC> Start today. Be thorough. Get'em all.
DW> Shit. I'm gonna need some more bullets. And several hundred hacksaw
DW> blades.
Don't forget the latex bags and habanero extract.
... "Bother" said Pooh, as he went to kill Owl.
___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30 [NR]
--- Platinum Xpress/Win/Wildcat5! v2.0GY
* Origin: Pacific Online Services ISP/BBS (707.588.0250) www.pon.net (1:2002/2002)
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|From: Lynda Bustilloz
|To: ABRAM GARCIA
|Sub: [2/3] True Christiani
|Date: 04 Mar 97 13:06:00
EID:58aa 226468c0
Lynda and Abram were killing time yakking about [2/3] True Christiani:
AG> On Fri 28-Feb-1997 12:19p, Lynda Bustilloz@1:109/1111.0 said to Joe
AG> Shedlock: LB> >>> Part 2 of 3...
LB> 3 Q. Who is a true Christian?
LB> A. A true Christian is he who is baptised, who believes and professes
the
LB> Christian Doctrine, and obeys the lawful pastors of the Church.
AG> hello Lynda
AG> couid you please explain this Q and A a bit more to me please?
AG> (go into detail about each of these above process that makes a true
AG> christian)
Hi Abram...the portion you are quoting was, I believe (I no longer have
my
original post in front of me), from a catholic catechism....which pope authored
it doesn't come to mind, but it was in the post.
I'm not entirely sure what you're asking....the post was in response to
a
question Joe Shedlock had asked seeking to find the 'root' behind the notion
of there being some creature called a "true christian"....I went looking
and
posted my results, regarding references to the idea of what a true christian
is.
As you may have noted, the answer itself varied depending on who was defining
it. As the above is a Roman Catholic view, I'd imagine the elements are:
baptised, using the Catholic formula. I'm not SURE what the requirements
for
an RC baptism are (or which denominations other than themselves they hold
as
offering valid baptisms), but I'm guessing it involves water, oil, and 'in
the name of the father, son and holy spirit'.
Christian Doctrine in that case likely translates into profession of the
Creeds,
and whatever RC dogmas have been decided to be Doctrine.
And lawful pastors....bet me that means the pope and those bishops and priests
considered legitimate by them.
I suspect, somehow, that you felt I was espousing the definition above rather
than just noting it as an example among many. :) I am not Roman Catholic.
Lynda Bustilloz http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8679/
bustilloz@geocities.com http://www.3HarpiesLtd.com
---
ž TLX v4.10 ž Wish I had some idea of what I'm asking. :-!
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR]
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|From: Lynda Bustilloz
|To: ROD SWIFT
|Sub: My Summer Weekend
|Date: 04 Mar 97 13:20:00
EID:d670 22646a80
Jim and Rod were killing time yakking about My Summer Weekend:
JS> I just looked at your list and responded accordingly...
RS> You are commanded not to judge. I'll have to set a harpy onto
RS> you if you don't behave, Jimson.
*Snort!*
Odd, but you don't LOOK like Zeus....
You're getting ahead of yourself, hellion, if you think you have the power
to command where the harpies aim their attention.
:) No fear, if Jim warrants a visit, he'll get one, but it will be by our
own choosing.
Lynda Bustilloz http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8679/
bustilloz@geocities.com http://www.3HarpiesLtd.com
---
ž TLX v4.10 ž BRAT: Someone else's kid that behaves like your own.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR]
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|From: Lynda Bustilloz
|To: JIM STAAL
|Sub: Baby in Critical Conditio
|Date: 04 Mar 97 13:29:00
EID:42da 22646ba0
Lynda and Jim were killing time yakking about Baby in Critical Conditio:
JS> Yeah, the Lovely Wilbur [tm] likes to read over my shoulder from time
JS> to time here, gets angry at what she terms the foolishness of the
JS> whole thing and walks away. :)
LB> Wilbur just wants to make sure you aren't talking to the wimmin!
JS> Yeah, well after 30 years she is a bit possessive, ya know. When you
JS> get a good man you don't want to lose same. :)
She got a good man? Aren't you JEALOUS??
Boy, break ONE little leg, and she takes advantage of the opportunity.....
;)
Lynda Bustilloz http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8679/
bustilloz@geocities.com http://www.3HarpiesLtd.com
---
ž TLX v4.10 ž "May Fortune favor the foolish." -- Kirk
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR]
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|From: Lynda Bustilloz
|To: KATHERINE WINTERSNIGHT
|Sub: return
|Date: 04 Mar 97 13:36:00
EID:e4c6 22646c80
Lynda and Katherine were killing time yakking about return:
LB>I think Michael would find it much safer in the kitchen where he could
keep
LB>a close eye on what ingredients go into what. However he MUST promise
to
KW> keep
LB>the coffee mugs filled, and not to listen too closely to the gossip.
KW> And not to do that goggle eyed thing. I hate it when he does that.
Well, when a manic cat is gouging into your leg, it's pretty hard to keep
your eyes from bugging out!
Lynda Bustilloz http://www.geocities.com/Athens/8679/
bustilloz@geocities.com http://www.3HarpiesLtd.com
---
ž TLX v4.10 ž Sponge cake: Dessert made of borrowed ingredients.
___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.20 [NR]
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|From: Becke Boyer
|To: David Worrell
|Sub: RE: ACLU NEWS 01-30-97: C
|Date: 10 Mar 97 11:39:30
EID:7191 226a5ce0
PID: ProBoard 2.15 J
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8644
On 3 Mar 97 02:09pm, DAVID WORRELL wrote to BECKE BOYER:
KY>>> Now, I am a few hairs away from being an actual Libertarian, but
KY>>> I'm not too far off.
BB>> Fer Christ sakes, from the shit you've been spouting here, you're both
BB>> as far off from Libertarianism as you can get.
DW> Get used to it. The Christian Coalition is in the process of
DW> infiltrating the Libertarian Party. They want a backup party on case
DW> the 'pubs finally get sick of them and kick them out.
Agreed, although I don't understand why. Unless they plan on restructuring
the whole Libertarian platform, the two schools of political thought are
as
incompatible as it gets. Not to mention, if the Christoids *did* take over
the Libertarian party, there would probably be a lot of people abandoning
the
party for something more in alignment with their actual stance.
DW> Expect some changes in the Libertarian Party line.
I'm not going to hold my breath, but I *will* point out blatant
inconsistencies to party platform like Jelly..;)
Becke
... Decadence with a redhead is its own reward!
* Evaluation copy of Silver Xpress. Day # 255
* Silver Xpress V4.01
--- PB 2.15/FE 1.45a/IM 2.50
* Origin: Stimpy's Sandbox | Lemoyne, Pa | 717.730.8504 (1:270/722)
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|From: Becke Boyer
|To: All
|Sub: ON HIATUS...
|Date: 10 Mar 97 11:39:31
EID:2704 226a5ce0
PID: ProBoard 2.15 J
TID: FastEcho 1.45a 8644
Hi, folks...
Paul and I are going to be moving in a couple of weeks, and to diffuse costs,
we're selling off the 'puter...so I won't be around for a couple of months
till we get around to picking up a new one.
At any rate, I can still be reached, either by e-mail at brboyer@hotmail.com,
or by snail mail or telephone at the following, effective 3/28.
Becke Boyer
1067 Summerwood Drive
Harrisburg, PA 17111
(717) 545-6775
I should still be around for the next week or so, so feel free to reply
to
any of my messages--I should still get them. Oh, and BTW, someone archive
the
good stuff. =) I'm sure as hell going to miss this place, and don't want
to
miss some of the better gems..
Becke
... *- The most insidious threat to Christianity : education.
* Evaluation copy of Silver Xpress. Day # 255
* Silver Xpress V4.01
--- PB 2.15/FE 1.45a/IM 2.50
* Origin: Stimpy's Sandbox | Lemoyne, Pa | 717.730.8504 (1:270/722)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: 'First Cause' Crap
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:00:47
EID:32d2 22690800
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220bbf
-> On 06 Mar 97 17:59:04, John Brawley got back to Dan Ceppa
JB> However, in a generic sense, it's as illogical to DISbelieve (in a
JB> "God" or gods) as it is to Believe. Neither position can be proven
or
DC> Do you disbelieve in Santa Claus, John? If so, why?
JB> Santa Claus is not a god?
That explains the bewilderment in you eyes when you have
been told that Zero _is_ a number.
... It was pity that stayed his hand. "Pity I've run out of bullets".
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
* Origin: North West Corner of Nowhere (1:123/67.5)
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: 'First Cause' Crap
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:03:03
EID:32d2 22690860
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220c47
-> On 06 Mar 97 17:59:55, John Brawley got back to Dan Ceppa
JB> I see no par-TIC-u-lars, Dan, ol' boy....
JB> All I see here is a Fundie "Is NOT!"
JB> Next time, quote my argument, and refute it where we can SEE you.
I'll provdide the milk crates for you to stand on. Just
how many do you require?
... The only time I open my mouth is to change feet!!: John Brawley
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: 'First Cause' Crap
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:04:33
EID:32d2 22690880
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220ca1
-> On 06 Mar 97 18:02:24, John Brawley got back to Dan Ceppa
JB> There is no zero block, Dan, just as there is no 'zero year,' 'zero
JB> minute,' or 'zero hour.'
Keep saying that, John. Even you will believe that if you
say that long enough.
... Evolution to D. Gish: "Look, I'm very upset the way you turned out..."
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: God Dan
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: ...
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:08:49
EID:5b08 22690900
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220da1
-> On 03 Mar 97 16:51:28, Ken Young got back to Quentin Fai
QF> It wasn't *that* much of a sacrifice. He's still alive, after all.
KY> Yes, He is. Glad you agree..
KY> Enduring pain can be a sacrifice too.
That's nice. I shall torture you to death for three
hours. Unforunately, unlike your "godling", I will ensure
that you are dead after that time.
Care to make the "sacrifice", Ken?
... +Origin: 3STOOGES NETWORK: Hey, Moe! Bucketheads for Hayzeus!
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Anthony Grigor-Scott
|Sub: 666
|Date: 09 Mar 97 01:14:09
EID:8e51 226909c0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33220ee1
-> On 07 Mar 97 13:54:57, Anthony Grigor-Scott got back to Fredric Rice
AG> Does your vocabulary reflect the character and proclivities of
AG> your mother? Or is is your father, the Devil?
I trust that you have evidence that your mother wasn't the
whore that everyone in here knows she was. (Careful! it
may mean that Kenny Wiens is your long lost brother.)
... "... God doesn't care what you think." -- James Davis
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Anthony Grigor-Scott
|Sub: Blavatsky?
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:25:34
EID:bf53 22697320
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3322c85e
-> On 07 Mar 97 13:56:27, Anthony Grigor-Scott got back to Dan Ceppa
AG> Christian greetings in the precious Name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Mighty white-sheeted of you, asshole.
AG> Here we go again, Dan Ceppa the anti-Semite, anti Hebrew bigot.
And, dip-shit, your evidence for that is?
AG> Instead of writing profanities and condemning good people ad truth
I'm not comdemning good people, Grigor-Mortis, I'm condemning you.
AG> you would do well to repent and seek the Lord while you may.
I'd seek your lord with heat-seeking missiles but your godling
doesn't register in the infra-red range. Seems like you "master"
is a bit cold after dying some 2,000 years ago.
AG> Kind regards,
Eat shit, hypocrite.
... Are you really THAT stupid, or do you have to work at it?
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Don Martin
|Sub: Celestial Bragging
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:40:06
EID:7311 22697500
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3322cbc6
-> On 07 Mar 97 23:54:33, Don Martin got back to All
DM> After all these years, I have finally seen a comet. Twice even.
Well, is ita cleaner sky for all of it's work?
DM> Wednesday, Hale-Bopp was about half the width of my little finger,
Must have missed it, especially last night, as I was out
be-bopping.
DM> held at arm's length. Yesterday, is was about 3/4 that width, and I
Smaller than the size of the moon, which is about the size of a
dime held out at arm's reach.
DM> coma. This morning it is overcast. Both sightings were around 5:15
DM> am EST.
What part of the sky? East? West? North/South? Over
Bethlehem with the Three Stooges in hot persuit?
DM> One of the advantages of dog ownership is being up and out for
DM> such things.
Take any advantage that you can! I hear that it's very bright
but doesn't have the long doggy-tail that the last one had.
IIRC, it'll be closest around 3/24 or so. I'll be up in
Victoria that week sailing. Hope to get a glimpse of it
then.
... Polar bear = Cartesian bear after coordinate transform
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: John Brawley
|Sub: Ceppa - Holographic
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:49:14
EID:ce8d 22697620
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3322cdea
-> On 06 Mar 97 18:25:33, John Brawley got back to Dan Ceppa
JB> Thanks for _your_ honesty as well. I had already fast-deleted the
That's because I'm an atheist and don't need to misquote to
make my point, like Appleton does.
JB> sentence, so instead of re-doing the message, I _wrote_ 'in the
JB> previous comment' (or something like that) instead, to be sure I
Too bad you didn't do that.
JB> didn't engender confusion. I obviously failed. I apologize for not
JB> doing it baldly in the first place, but:
The hair treatments you've been getting haven't taken root?
JB> The remarkable thing to _me_ was that D. Worrell quoted the entire
JB> message back, as asked, _with_ your misuse in it where it first
No he didn't, John. He replied to what you quoted. Nothing
more, nothing less.
JB> appeared, and then he -still- accused me of being wrong about your
JB> previous use of "your" for "you're" even when it was staring him in
JB> the face....
I saw the quote that he commented on, written by you. I did
not make that mistake in that particular posting. Perhaps now
others will understand the whys and wherefores of Appleton's
lies.
... Error #666: Hard Drive Possessed. Load EXOR.SYS (Y/n)?
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Marty Leipzig
|Sub: Cheese Whiz
|Date: 09 Mar 97 14:55:25
EID:bf43 226976e0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3322cf5d
-> On 08 Mar 97 03:04:00, Marty Leipzig got back to Richard Smith
RS> The first recorded case of Spontaneous Algernon Syndrome . . .
ML> Should we send flowers?
C-4 with an appropriate time delay would me more fun.
BTW, nice to see you back, Rock Knocker. You missed a
few(?) laughs during your absinthes(sic).
... And God said: E = «mvż - Zeż/r, and there was light!
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
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|From: God Dan
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Clones vs Clowns
|Date: 09 Mar 97 15:03:43
EID:d8c0 22697860
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3322d14f
-> On 06 Mar 97 13:32:28, Ken Young got back to Judith Bandsma
JB> a clone of myself and see what I could have become without all the shit
JB> that fucked me over the first time.
KY> The main reason not to play God in this way, that I can think of, is
Your "god" does it all the time. He created you, didn't he?
KY> this could lead the way towards what Hitler and many others have long
KY> dreamed of, and that is the creation of the master race.
Based on your bible. Face it, Kenny, Hitler was an xian to
the nth degree. Thank Saul, your foundimg father, for your
fuck-ups.
... Xtianity n. Crucifixion fiction.
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: Evidences for God
|Date: 09 Mar 97 19:52:13
EID:76f2 22699e80
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 332314ed
-> On 04 Mar 97 12:14:20, Ken Young got back to Dan Ceppa
DR> Amen to that, Brother! One God and one God only! The question
DC> Seems like your Jesus must be a myth, then.
KY> Same God.
Yep, one schizophrenic myth.
... "Instant fundy: just add flood water and bake in hell to taste." - HP
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Ed Mills
|Sub: Fundy Frolics
|Date: 09 Mar 97 20:00:50
EID:513a 2269a000
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 332316f2
-> On 07 Mar 97 04:52:29, Ed Mills got back to Norman Solomon
NS> OK Judith you got me what is an "emesis basin"?
EM> Accessory intended for use with Ipecac, Billy Graham, etc.
Hmmm, I thought Billy Graham was the emesis.
... The blessing received is well worth the money.--Jim Staal
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Jim Staal
|Sub: Ha!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 22:28:02
EID:6326 2269b380
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33233972
-> On 07 Mar 97 04:58:24, Jim Staal got back to Rod Swift
RS> You use the word "gook" as a synonym for the languages and
RS> peoples of Vietnam.
JS> Oh, I did, did I? And where was that?
Your memory is nearly as short as your dick, Staal:
Ä Area: HolySmoke ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
Msg#: 24334 Date: 08-14-96 12:53
From: Jim Staal Read: Yes Replied:
No
To: Karl Schneider Mark:
Subj: EDUCATIONAL EXPERIENC
ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ
On (13 Aug 96) Karl Schneider wrote to Jim Staal...
JS> GT> They took me, eagerly, at 6'5" and 250#. My topkick was 7'4".
JS> JS> You were in Vietnam?
JS> DC> If he was, it was _Viet Nam_, "English Major".
KS> JS>So what has that to do with speaking/spelling Gook, eh?
KS> You really are an asshole.
You really get to be at a loss for words, don't you?
... I didn't DO IT;nobody SAW me;you can't PROVE it;the Sheep are LIARS!
============================================
Now, shithead, make a big fuss about how I spelled Vietnam again
while you ignore your use of the word, 'Gook', "English Major".
... "If ignorance was illegal there wouldn't be fundies." Marty Leipzig
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Laurie Appleton
|Sub: Harry Truman.
|Date: 09 Mar 97 22:35:22
EID:2575 2269b460
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33233b2a
-> On 08 Mar 97 05:39:04, Laurie Appleton got back to Dan Ceppa
DC> Tell me about your walk with Truman, Laurie.
DC> You continue to evade that part of your story. I'd like
DC> to know what a personable person that the former Prez
DC> was in private life.
LA> Ah, you DO seem keen to improve your education then. See
LA> what you think of the following;
[all not doing with the question at hand, deleted]
And the answer is:
Hmmm, nothing Laurie, not a word about your walk with the
Prez. I'm SO disappointed in you. Your attention span
seems not to be able to cross a small stream. In fact,
I doubt that you can get out of the gutter you are in.
... Brought to you by the letters F, O & D and the no. 69
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|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Ken Young
|Sub: He Does It Again!
|Date: 09 Mar 97 22:39:31
EID:9138 2269b4e0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33233c23
-> On 06 Mar 97 13:30:32, Ken Young got back to Martin Goldberg
KY>> Gays will go to Hell if they are not saved, and if you
KY>> are gay, you cannot be saved.
MG> Fuck your god.
KY> No, I am pretty sure sex with a supernatural being is forbidden.
Why? Your god is intent on screwing everyone and has done
just that. It's about time your god gets what coming
to it in return.
IOW, fuck the bastard god that you worship.
... Thrusting in him and having a simply DIVINE relationship--Al Tufano
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* Origin: North West Corner of Nowhere (1:123/67.5)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
SEEN-BY: 147/34 2021 167/166 170/400 202/777 1207 213/213 218/890 907
SEEN-BY: 270/101 275/429 280/1 169 282/1 62 283/120 284/29 290/14 300/603
SEEN-BY: 310/666 322/739 323/107 324/278 343/600 346/250 352/3 356/18 369/32
SEEN-BY: 371/42 377/86 380/64 381/900 382/92 388/1 396/1 2 690/660 730/2
SEEN-BY: 732/10 2401/0 2442/0 3603/420 3606/10 3612/41 3615/50 3619/25
SEEN-BY: 3632/21 3651/9 3652/1 3667/1
PATH: 123/67 302 43 270/101 396/1 124/1 9005
|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: ROBERT CURRY
|Sub: infinitesimals
|Date: 09 Mar 97 22:53:15
EID:75a0 2269b6a0
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 33233f5b
-> On 05 Mar 97 19:26:14, ROBERT CURRY got back to DAVE HAMILTON
RC> Only eleven steps from ZERO, not a south-of-the-border HERO,
[..]
RC> reach that fencing FOIL.
DH> Sorry, I only had three university math courses. Was that a 'yes'?
RC> You are permitted to change one letter at a time, to change one word
RC> into another via intermediate words. Shortest path from WORD1 to WORD2
RC> is the winner. Care to give it a try?
You forgot to tell him about the extra bonus points that you
get when you use all the words in a sentence. That, and the
extra special prize of keeping the sentence on thread.
At least I also know why you wrote what you did! LOL!
... +Origin: John Brawley's Quantum Bait Shop & Non-locality Emporium
--- OMX/Blue Wave v2.12
* Origin: North West Corner of Nowhere (1:123/67.5)
SEEN-BY: 12/12 24/888 102/2 943 106/2000 109/7 112/101 114/262 271 124/1
SEEN-BY: 124/1208 2342 5125 8001 9000 9005 130/1 1008 133/2 140/3 143/1
SEEN-BY: 147/34 2021 167/166 170/400 202/777 1207 213/213 218/890 907
SEEN-BY: 270/101 275/429 280/1 169 282/1 62 283/120 284/29 290/14 300/603
SEEN-BY: 310/666 322/739 323/107 324/278 343/600 346/250 352/3 356/18 369/32
SEEN-BY: 371/42 377/86 380/64 381/900 382/92 388/1 396/1 2 690/660 730/2
SEEN-BY: 732/10 2401/0 2442/0 3603/420 3606/10 3612/41 3615/50 3619/25
SEEN-BY: 3632/21 3651/9 3652/1 3667/1
PATH: 123/67 302 43 270/101 396/1 124/1 9005
|From: Dan Ceppa
|To: Dave Hamilton
|Sub: infinitesimals
|Date: 09 Mar 97 22:56:30
EID:723f 2269b700
PID: OMX 1.00.DOS [NR]
MSGID: 1:123/67.5 3323401e
-> On 08 Mar 97 06:13:32, Dave Hamilton got back to ROBERT CURRY
RC> into another via intermediate words. Shortest path from WORD1 to
RC> WORD2 is the winner. Care to give it a try?
DH>